The Vamos Albiceleste thread v2.0 **SPOILERS**

[threervana]

It clones the 4222 in the OG.
But a diffrent defence line and Gago is repalced by Cuchu and Kun by Apache!

[chauchey]

Whats Pato's injury like? Is he out for a while? Also, did D'Allessandro get the call up in the end? Or did Roman take that spot?

[Arg10]

D'Allesandro didn't even make the bench and I haven't read about how serious Pato's injury is. But atleast we have Carrizo.

[threervana]

Pato's injury is not too serious. He will recover in two to three weeks.

I love your sig ,Arg10.:)

[west501]

4 points in our last 5 matches..0 wins
terrible play, if we'd won that last night, and we had it won, the robbery would have been little consolation
we're being mocked in the regional press and our players have targets on them for high pressure that Dunga has shown works
it is no longer the quality of the opponent that matters but our lack of cohesiveness that makes us vulberable to any opponent
the problem is not without a solution and I think it could be solved in one match, but I'd like to hear/react to others thoughts instead of ranting against Basile

[Arg10]

Time for a long post. This one is way overdue.

Basile: For the love of me, I can't understand why he's still the coach. I really can't. He's been here for 2 years and still has absolutely no clue what the hell he's doing. ANYONE can do his job. I repeat, ANYONE. We have all the talent in the World and he still messes up his starting XI. He refuses to use a freaking #9(if Crespo watched the match last night, he must of been laughing his ass off over Denis). I still don't know why we can't just use Crespo. Basile's version of a #9 is Cruz. Julio freaking Cruz! Not someone who is an established and fantastic goal scorer with Argentina in the form of Crespo, but Cruz. In the first 2 matches of the Copa America last year, we wern't playing that well to be honest. Who was there to knock in the goals when they counted? Crespo. But the idiot decides to pick Cruz as a #9 and when that doesn't work, he decides to go with 3 midgets up front in Messi, Aguero and Tevez. That Riquelme free kick in the 15-16th minute versus Peru was screaming #9. Aguero was too short to head it in, so in the end the opportunity was wasted. I don't care how old Crespo is or will be in 2010. The fact is that other than Crespo we don't have a solid #9 because Basile refuses to play Cavenaghi, Higuain isn't getting enough playing time with Madrid and he just flat out doesn't want to use Lisandro Lopez. So for now, Crespo is our only option. Batistuta was older than Crespo is now and still made it to the 2002 World Cup(and before anyone says anything, we didn't lose that World Cup because of him, 2002 alone is a whole different subject).

The constant idea in his head that Pato is a real #1 is not even funny, it's just sad. He NEVER looked confident during the Copa America, which made our back line nervous(Ayala's own goal in the final is the perfect example). Pato who did wonders with Boca, is past his prime. He did bad with Getafe(don't even get me started on that UEFA Cup match versus Bayern) and he's doing even worse with the National Team. Thankfully, reality forced Basile to use Carrizo. I've said this once and I'll say it again. If you're ever going to sub Riquelme off, you better make sure Aimar is on the bench. His love for Boca Juniors players and hatred towards River Plate is alarming(this coming from a Boca fan). The one time Aimar really got to play a full match under Basile was versus Paraguay in the Copa America and he did very well. In the World Cup he was fantastic. But, he's a River player so he wasn't used in ANY of the WCQ matches. Can't forget Crespo, but I've already touched on that. Thank God he has the common sence(which has never been Basile's strong point) to use Mascherano.

To be honest, I'm not completely pissed off that we've drawn so many of our WCQ matches. Because atleast these problems are occuring now and not in 2010. Because as we all know, one bad tactical move can cost us the tournament(just watch the last 20 minutes of the Germany match from 2006). When I saw the line-ups for Peru I was actually happy to see Gutierrez in there. He did very well versus Brazil, he's a speedy player who attracts defenders, but sadly he didn't play very long. He had to be subbed off. But again, since common sence has never been Basile's strong point, he decides to bring in Battaglia(who happens to be a Boca player) instead of Di Maria(another quick player who's passes/crosses are just mouth watering). Now this is what I don't get. We have all these young players who can challenge for midfield(Banega, Di Maria, Garay) who are being wasted on older players who can't get the job done. Don't get me wrong, I have absolutely no problem with playing older players, as long as they can still do what they are supposed to do. Banega could of been brought on for Gutierrez if Basile really didn't want to use Di Maria. Opportunity wasted. Instead of giving Garay a chance to play, he gives someone like Coloccini who is a ticking time bomb when it comes to mistakes. Another thing I don't understand, the absence of Maxi Rodriguez. I get the feeling he's in the dog house. From what I've read(I could be wrong), one of the reasons why Basile didn't pick him for the WCQ was because he didn't want to play a useless friendly versus Belarus because his team was in a Champions League 3rd round match. I don't know about you guys, but I would of done the same thing as Maxi.

Our inability to play as a team is really starting to scare me. Riquelme only looks to pass it to Messi, Messi is trying to be Superman and take on the entire team on his own, crosses/corners/free kicks are being wasted, without Mascherano we just can't seem to get going in midfield right now, Tevez runs his ass off in midfield to get the ball when his real job is to score.

What I'm trying to say is get rid of Basile.

[deviant]

Thank god the Legend himself finally spoke up....

Messi Can Be Too Greedy - Maradona

Diego Maradona has lambasted his friend Lionel Messi for being too greedy and lamented Argentina's inability to dominate games in the World Cup qualifiers.

The Albiceleste legend pulled no punches during his country's 1-1 draw with Peru in Lima and believes that things need to be changed if the team are to become world beaters again.

Messi has been tipped to win the Ballon d'Or this year, but Maradona thinks that the star needs to be more of a team player if he is to become the best.

"Messi at times plays only for Messi. He forgets about his tem-mates. If he played more along with Agüero and Riquelme then the scoreboard could be a lot better," he told Fox Sports.

"I hope he can go on and be better than me, it would be great for Argentina."

Maradona was unhappy also at Argentina being unable to hold the lead after scoring so close to the end through Esteban Cambiasso before Peru netted an injury time leveller.

"It worries me that we cannot finish games off by applying more and more pressure," he added.

[threervana]

Time for a long post. This one is way overdue.

Basile: For the love of me, I can't understand why he's still the coach. I really can't. He's been here for 2 years and still has absolutely no clue what the hell he's doing. ANYONE can do his job. I repeat, ANYONE. We have all the talent in the World and he still messes up his starting XI. He refuses to use a freaking #9(if Crespo watched the match last night, he must of been laughing his ass off over Denis). I still don't know why we can't just use Crespo. Basile's version of a #9 is Cruz. Julio freaking Cruz! Not someone who is an established and fantastic goal scorer with Argentina in the form of Crespo, but Cruz. In the first 2 matches of the Copa America last year, we wern't playing that well to be honest. Who was there to knock in the goals when they counted? Crespo. But the idiot decides to pick Cruz as a #9 and when that doesn't work, he decides to go with 3 midgets up front in Messi, Aguero and Tevez. That Riquelme free kick in the 15-16th minute versus Peru was screaming #9. Aguero was too short to head it in, so in the end the opportunity was wasted. I don't care how old Crespo is or will be in 2010. The fact is that other than Crespo we don't have a solid #9 because Basile refuses to play Cavenaghi, Higuain isn't getting enough playing time with Madrid and he just flat out doesn't want to use Lisandro Lopez. So for now, Crespo is our only option. Batistuta was older than Crespo is now and still made it to the 2002 World Cup(and before anyone says anything, we didn't lose that World Cup because of him, 2002 alone is a whole different subject).

The constant idea in his head that Pato is a real #1 is not even funny, it's just sad. He NEVER looked confident during the Copa America, which made our back line nervous(Ayala's own goal in the final is the perfect example). Pato who did wonders with Boca, is past his prime. He did bad with Getafe(don't even get me started on that UEFA Cup match versus Bayern) and he's doing even worse with the National Team. Thankfully, reality forced Basile to use Carrizo. I've said this once and I'll say it again. If you're ever going to sub Riquelme off, you better make sure Aimar is on the bench. His love for Boca Juniors players and hatred towards River Plate is alarming(this coming from a Boca fan). The one time Aimar really got to play a full match under Basile was versus Paraguay in the Copa America and he did very well. In the World Cup he was fantastic. But, he's a River player so he wasn't used in ANY of the WCQ matches. Can't forget Crespo, but I've already touched on that. Thank God he has the common sence(which has never been Basile's strong point) to use Mascherano.

To be honest, I'm not completely pissed off that we've drawn so many of our WCQ matches. Because atleast these problems are occuring now and not in 2010. Because as we all know, one bad tactical move can cost us the tournament(just watch the last 20 minutes of the Germany match from 2006). When I saw the line-ups for Peru I was actually happy to see Gutierrez in there. He did very well versus Brazil, he's a speedy player who attracts defenders, but sadly he didn't play very long. He had to be subbed off. But again, since common sence has never been Basile's strong point, he decides to bring in Battaglia(who happens to be a Boca player) instead of Di Maria(another quick player who's passes/crosses are just mouth watering). Now this is what I don't get. We have all these young players who can challenge for midfield(Banega, Di Maria, Garay) who are being wasted on older players who can't get the job done. Don't get me wrong, I have absolutely no problem with playing older players, as long as they can still do what they are supposed to do. Banega could of been brought on for Gutierrez if Basile really didn't want to use Di Maria. Opportunity wasted. Instead of giving Garay a chance to play, he gives someone like Coloccini who is a ticking time bomb when it comes to mistakes. Another thing I don't understand, the absence of Maxi Rodriguez. I get the feeling he's in the dog house. From what I've read(I could be wrong), one of the reasons why Basile didn't pick him for the WCQ was because he didn't want to play a useless friendly versus Belarus because his team was in a Champions League 3rd round match. I don't know about you guys, but I would of done the same thing as Maxi.

Our inability to play as a team is really starting to scare me. Riquelme only looks to pass it to Messi, Messi is trying to be Superman and take on the entire team on his own, crosses/corners/free kicks are being wasted, without Mascherano we just can't seem to get going in midfield right now, Tevez runs his ass off in midfield to get the ball when his real job is to score.

What I'm trying to say is get rid of Basile.

Objectively speaking, Aimar didn't do well versus Paraguay in the Copa America. In the past year, Aimar operated a surgery and he didn't really played too many matches. That's why Basile didn't pick him. As for Crespo, the reason is that he did not get many chances in his club. Personally, I hope they both could come back to NT and I believe Basile will give them another opportunity if they play well in their clubs no matter how old their are. Although Basile has preference over Boca players, he still uses many River Men, such as Demichelis , Cambisso and Cruz.

Besides, I think Coloccini is not a obvious ticking time bomb any more. And Garay is not outstanding enough to earn a place in NT, as well as Banega. They both need more time to improve.

And Battaglia was the best player of Boca in the first half year, so he deserved a call up and some play time. But I am also a little pissed off when Basile replaced Jonas for Batta, hey, you should bring in an attacking player when you face Peru!

[west501]

I had to let my mind rest for a while. I think Carlitos Tévez is a symptom of what is wrong with Basile's selección. Basile likes to wipe himself clean of any responsibility once the ball starts rolling. He puts in the right players to get the job done and if we win, it's because he was right, if we lose it's because they were bad on the day. His comment after the Copa America upset was that he would have made 11 changes at half time. He admittedly does not watch videos or analyse the tactics and wouldn't think of changing the way we play against any opponent becuase arguably we shouldn't have to.
But back to Tévez, here is a player that has all of the pressure to perform. He has proved he can do it, and now Basile's instruction is do it again. "Touch the ball, play like you know how" is the most instruction the players will get from this trainer. Carlitos has played for and thrived with some of the best tacticians in the game: Bianchi, Bielsa, and now Ferguson. But Basile, who is famous for imposing no tactical restrictions on his players may not be the right man for the job right now. He's somehow come out of this with backing from Grondona, and even I believe that we can build off of one important win, like the one we need against Uruguay in a few weeks. But if we end the first half weakly and falter in Santiago against their far superior trainer, Basile may be in deep trouble.

[Arg10]

Here's the list for the November World Cup Qualifiers.

Juan Pablo Carrizo (Lazio)
Sergio Romero (AZ Alkmaar)

Fabricio Coloccini (Newcastle)
Martín Demichelis (Bayern Munich)
Gabriel Heinze (Real Madrid)
Nicolás Burdisso (Inter)
Daniel Díaz (Getafe)
Luciano Monzón (Betis)
Javier Zanetti (Inter)
Pablo Zabaleta (Manchester City)

Esteban Cambiasso (Inter)
Javier Mascherano (Liverpool)
Maxi Rodríguez (Atlético Madrid)
Angel Di María (Benfica)

Lionel Messi (Barcelona)
Carlos Tevez (Manchester United)
Diego Milito (Genoa)
Sergio Agüero (Atlético Madrid)

The South American based players list should be released sometime this week.

Not surprised to see Milito in there. 4 goals in 3 games if I'm not mistaken. Basile better not play Messi/Aguero/Tevez up front... the sad part is, I wouldn't even be surprised. I would of prefered to see Higuain in there instead of Tevez right now. Speaking of which, I really think this is Tevez's last chance with the National Team(sort of). If the guy gets himself red carded again in one of the two matches, I really think we should start looking at other players. You can add Riquelme to the midfield. I imagine it'll be something like Di Maria, Riquelme and Maxi with Mascherano(or Cambiasso... or both knowing Basile) playing behind them. Basile really wants to experiment with the backline doesn't he? 8? Jesus. Good to see Monzon get a chance. And last but not least, Pato is not on the goalkeeper list.

[west501]

Here's the list for the November World Cup Qualifiers.

Juan Pablo Carrizo (Lazio)
Sergio Romero (AZ Alkmaar)

Fabricio Coloccini (Newcastle)
Martín Demichelis (Bayern Munich)
Gabriel Heinze (Real Madrid)
Nicolás Burdisso (Inter)
Daniel Díaz (Getafe)
Luciano Monzón (Betis)
Javier Zanetti (Inter)
Pablo Zabaleta (Manchester City)

Esteban Cambiasso (Inter)
Javier Mascherano (Liverpool)
Maxi Rodríguez (Atlético Madrid)
Angel Di María (Benfica)

Lionel Messi (Barcelona)
Carlos Tevez (Manchester United)
Diego Milito (Genoa)
Sergio Agüero (Atlético Madrid)

The South American based players list should be released sometime this week.

And last but not least, Pato is not on the goalkeeper list.

that made my day! hadn't even noticed it! finally! after so many years!
.
.
.
(I know he's injured, but please let me and the rest of Argentina celebrate this)

what about Zárate? the revelation of serie a deserves a call
and congrats to Monzón, who gets a deserved call as our best young left back in a long time
with a player like him we have the opportunity to use a line of 3 defenders with him on the left side of the midfield, completing a line of 4 if necessary
note, we can still do so on the right with the eternal Zanetti, and with the incredible squad player we have in Zabaleta
Zabaleta, imo, is one of our most underrated and important young players for the future..essential for a championship team

I'd like to see
JuamPa Carrizo forever :cool::cool::D:cool:
Zanetti(c)-Micho-Heinze-Monzón
Maxi-Masche-Cambiasso
Román
Messi-Agüero

[Arg10]

I'm really not sure how we should approach the next matches. I'd love to see Maxi start and all signs point to that. I look at Maxi now and the Maxi of 2006(with the National Team) and I see a completely different player. I blame this on Basile. In 2006 Pekerman gave him the freedom to sort of roam around and help the attack(at times he looked like a third striker alongside Crespo and Saviola). But with Basile, he has less freedom and has to defend more(the third striker role is now on Riquelme). Maxi has more defensive duties and I'm all for it, but don't play 2 or even 3 DM's and tell Maxi to defend. Or else you have Messi who is marked by a minimum of 2 players, Aguero who doesn't like to be the main #9 and a Riquelme who's on/off. We need our wingers(I'd like to see Maxi/Di Maria on both sides) attack. In the World Cup we had Maxi and Sorin attacking where as now we have a Riquelme and Zanetti(I love Zanetti to death, but that shouldn't be his responsibility to play as a CF like Basile wants him to). I'd love to see the Maxi/Aguero link-up in effect with the National Team. If we do decide to play Monzon, atleast he loves to attack. I was watching Argentina vs. Brazil from the Olympics and for most of the match Riquelme was either on the left side(supporting Di Maria) or he was in the middle. When he was supporting Di Maria it allowed Gago to advance a bit and help the attack. And in case anything went wrong, we had Mascherano behind him to help out.

Now comes the big question. Will Basile play with a #9 in Milito? At this point I wouldn't be surprised if Basile didn't even know. If we play Milito, I would prefer a:

3-4-1-2
Zanetti-Micho-Heinze/Monzon
Maxi-Mascherano-Cambiasso-Di Maria
Roman
Messi-Milito

or like guest501 mentioned, a 4-3-1-2. It's easy to switch between the two. To be honest, I'm sick of playing 2 midgets in the front or even 3(that game versus Bolivia... Jesus Christ) where we had Aguero/Tevez/Messi. Aguero is not made to be a #9, thats why he doesn't play it with Atletico Madrid. Thats Forlan's job, not Aguero's. Sad part is Basile hasn't realised it yet. I'm not saying just try and cross the ball to the #9 and hope he scores because it certainly didn't work in 2002 with all those crosses into the box. Another big question is how is Tevez used? Let's be realistic, Tevez/Messi up front hasn't worked yet. It didn't work in the Copa America and it hasn't worked in the Qualifiers. We'll never play Aguero/Tevez because that'll mean Messi won't play. Another thing we have to look into is Riquelme's replacement/back-up. What the hell will we do if Riquelme gets injured 2 minutes into a match? Or halfway into the match or just injured, period? Realise how Basile has rarely subed Riquelme off? He has no other choice but to play him. Lucho hasn't meshed well with the National Team and Aimar is injury prone. That leaves us with Banega. He's already getting more playing time with Atletico then he ever had with Valencia, so that's a plus. We have to think of the future. And thats the problem. Basile doesn't think about the future, heck, he barely thinks of the present. Case in point, Zanetti. I already mentioned how much I love him. He's a class act, a legend... but we have to start playing Zabaleta. I don't want to wait until Zanetti gets injured in a match in the World Cup and Zabaleta comes in or something. I'm talking about giving this guy some serious playing time. Then we have the story of forwards that I've already touched on. Except we have; Tevez, Aguero, Higuain, Zarate, Milito, Crespo(assuming he gets some playing time), Cavenaghi, Lisandro Lopez. And if someone says Denis, I'm gonna shoot them. The ones that I feel will not get any playing time at all is Cavenaghi and Lopez. Basile pretty much all but said that as long as Cavenaghi is playing in an "inferior" league, he won't get a chance with the National Team. Lopez has had like 5 minutes per match to "prove" himself to Basile and since he hasn't scored a goal in those 5 minutes, Basile will not pick him. That leaves us with Tevez, Aguero, Zarete, Milito, Crespo(to some extent) and Higuain. The latter has to be picked. In case anyone didn't know, Higuain can play for either France or Argentina. Even though he stated that he wants to play for Argentina and has played for Argentina's U23, we can't take the risk of waiting too long on him. He's finally getting some playing time with Madrid and it's only a matter of time before he is picked. I'm thinking he might finally get the call for Argentina when we face France in February(or January, I forget).

In any case, Basile has alot of work and it isn't getting any easier.

[west501]

I doubt we'll see any major changes, though I'd like to suggest one: give Messi the 10
Barça did it and I think it's time for la Pulga to wear the storied shirt for the national team

Basile, since he plays without a system, is having a hard time getting results from his players
the Copa America (except the flukey final match) was an example of things going right for Basile
but right now we see players in scintillating club form that can't do it with undefined roles on the national team
a lot of this falls on the loss of form of Riquelme, who should relinquish the 10 and possibly a starting role
the most interesting thing with the seleccionado was that we kept on playing better without Román before the June qualifiers and have played terribly since
does Basile realise this? he probably does
he likes to play with a surprise in the formation..will it be playing without Román against our oldest rivals?

[DSGB]

Watching Higuain go uncapped in each of these matches makes me very nervous. If Coco doesn't give him some sort of chance, we may never know how good he could have been for us while he's playing for France. Lock this guy up and give him a chance!

[msi2]

Watching Higuain go uncapped in each of these matches makes me very nervous. If Coco doesn't give him some sort of chance, we may never know how good he could have been for us while he's playing for France. Lock this guy up and give him a chance!

Stop freaking out about Higuain playing for France. :rolleyes:
He's not going to.

[threervana]

I hope Basile could just return to the traditional 4312 which he applied so well while he's coaching Boca, and more importantly, let the wings fly:
Carrizo
Zanetti(c)-Micho-Heinze-Monzón
Maxi-Masche-Di Maria
Román
Messi-Milito

[DSGB]

Stop freaking out about Higuain playing for France. :rolleyes:
He's not going to.

Do you honestly believe that if a player isn't given a chance with one team when he has a choice of two teams that he won't eventually go with the team that will give him a chance? Naive of you to say the least. And as far as "freaking out" get out of here with that.

[Arg10]

Here are the rest of the players called up by Basile.

Riquelme, Somoza, Pablo Barrientos, Gonzalo Bergessio, Orion and Cristian Ledesma.

So here's the FULL squad.

Juan Pablo Carrizo (Lazio)
Sergio Romero (AZ Alkmaar)
Agustín Orion (San Lorenzo)

Fabricio Coloccini (Newcastle)
Martín Demichelis (Bayern Munich)
Gabriel Heinze (Real Madrid)
Nicolás Burdisso (Inter)
Daniel Díaz (Getafe)
Luciano Fabián Monzón (Betis)
Javier Zanetti (Inter)
Pablo Zabaleta (Manchester City)

Esteban Cambiasso (Inter)
Javier Mascherano (Liverpool)
Pablo Barrientos (San Lorenzo)
Juan Román Riquelme (Boca)
Angel Di María (Benfica)
Cristian Ledesma (San Lorenzo)
Leandro Somoza (Vélez)

Lionel Messi (Barcelona)
Carlos Tevez (Manchester United)
Diego Milito (Genoa)
Sergio Agüero (Atlético de Madrid)
Gonzalo Bergessio (San Lorenzo)

[msi2]

Good to see Somoza, he's really impressive at the moment. Not a big fan of Bergessio event though he's excellent at the moment.

Oh by the way Basile, did you see Roman's performances lately? He's sucking right now. Let's hope you take note of it.

[west501]

Here are the rest of the players called up by Basile.

Riquelme, Somoza, Pablo Barrientos, Gonzalo Bergessio, Orion and Cristian Ledesma.

this is a typical Basile move because San Lorenzo are on fire right now
they will probably win the league and Barrientos and Bergessio in particular are in fantastic form
but I doubt very much we would see any of those players start, with Ledesma perhaps being the likeliest

[threervana]

I'm happy the caveman(?!) in guest's sig get a call.

Fresh Blood, although actually he has been called up once.

[Arg10]

So my spanish isn't perfect, but it seems as if Riquelme has a knock on his foot?

"Basile no hablará con la prensa hasta después del partido del próximo sábado con Uruguay. Siempre que Argentina juega por las Eliminatorias hay una conferencia previa, pero no es este el caso. El plantel se entrenó en Ezeiza, mientras que Riquelme sólo trabajó en el gimnasio por un golpe en el metatarsiano del pie izquierdo."
-http://www.ole.clarin.com

Maxi might be doubtful for both matches since he was limping off the pitch during the Barcelona/Atletico match. So we have an injured Maxi and an already not so good Riquelme.

Does anyone think we should try out a match without Riquelme? I know Qualifiers isn't the time, but we did stay a full year without Riquelme and we didn't do too bad. We beat France without him(and without a real playmaker, though it could of been Lucho Gonzalez, not entirely sure), beat Algeria and I think drew with Switzerland. I'm not gonna count the loss versus Brazil since it was Basile's first game back and against Brazil of all teams. The Spain match was also close. Question is, if we do play without Riquelme, who could be a playmaker for us? Because right now with Basile's system we need to have one. Is it time to start benching Riquelme and giving the responsibility to Messi or would that be too much? Is it time to bring Lucho back... do we even bring him back, ever? Do we call up the midget of all midgets in Buonanotte?

I'm asking all these questions because I was sitting in class bored out my mind when I started thinking about the different coaches that we've had and most notably, Pekerman. Ever since Pekerman's first match with Argentina, versus Uruguay where he called up Riquelme, he centered the entire team around Riquelme. By the way, for anyone who hasn't seen that match, I recommend to try and get it. Riquelme put on a passing clinic. Back to my point. Perkerman made the team revolve around Riquelme, which is what Basile is attempting to do, but he did it amazingly well. So well to the point where when Riquelme was taken off versus England in a friendly in 2005 and versus Germany, we lost both matches. My point is that Basile is trying to make the team about Messi and Riquelme, which is fine. To a certain extent Batista did it in the Olympics by playing them both close to each other and it worked great. Yet Basile can't seem to do that. He plays them too far apart, he tries to play Messi as an out and out striker at times to the point where he(Basile) pretty much neglects the other striker(Tevez, Aguero).

The more I think about it the more nervous I get. The World Cup is 2 years away and Basile doesn't have a damn clue what he's doing. I know it sounds like the same old song, but it's true. In friendlys instead of experimenting with other players/other tactics, he decides to play Zanetti, Messi, Heinze and others. While forgetting that there are other players such as Monzon, Zabaleta and guess who, Cavenaghi and Lopez. He should be experimenting with a number 9, but his stubborness is getting us no where. Not sure if anyone heard this, but it seems as if Basile was extremely close to calling up Palermo, yes, Palermo of all people to the recent round of WCQ(the one versus Paraguay and Peru).

Assuming Maxi doesn't play, anyone wanna guess who might replace him? I just hope Di Maria starts again(I still can't believe Battaglia got subed in for Gutierrez instead of him). This is what I think we'll see.

Versus Uruguay:
Carrizo
Zanetti-Micho-Coloccini-Heinze
Mascherano-Cambiasso-Di Maria
Roman
Messi-Milito

Versus Chile:
Carrizo
Zanetti-Micho-Burdisso/Diaz-Monzon
Mascherano-Cambiasso-Di Maria
Roman
Messi-Milito/Tevez/Aguero

The reason why I'm thinking Burdisso/Diaz instead of Coloccini is because we all know how much Basile seems to love Diaz and because he's an idiot so he would start Burdisso. Monzon instead of Heinze because I don't think he picked several "new" defencemen just for the sake of picking them(although with Basile you never know). That and if Heinze messes up even once(especially so soon) I don't doubt for a second that Basile would play Monzon. Milito/Tevez/Aguero all depends on how the first match goes.

Just some food for thought.

[west501]

most importantly that quote says Basile will not give the usual pre-match press conference
makes sense..what does he have to say? :p:eek:
I expect Riquelme, who is bothered by a sore left foot, will play
but I guess we won't know until just before kickoff
we usually play inspired football against Uruguay at home, so I hope this match will be no different
I'm expecting to see, for no particular reason, the following

JP Carrizo forever :cool:
Zanetti(c)-Micho-Heinze-Monzón
Masche-Ledesma-Cambiasso
Román
Messi-Tévez

let's see if I'm close ;)

[Arg10]

most importantly that quote says Basile will not give the usual pre-match press conference
makes sense..what does he have to say? :p:eek:
I expect Riquelme, who is bothered by a sore left foot, will play
but I guess we won't know until just before kickoff
we usually play inspired football against Uruguay at home, so I hope this match will be no different
I'm expecting to see, for no particular reason, the following

JP Carrizo forever :cool:
Zanetti(c)-Micho-Heinze-Monzón
Masche-Ledesma-Cambiasso
Román
Messi-Tévez

let's see if I'm close ;)

Might wanna replace Carlitos with Aguero or Milito(most likely Aguero from what I just read) for the first match, Other than that, I'm not sure about the midfield.

[threervana]

oh~ It has been 4 years with JRR as our #10.

As Maxi could not play, I hope to see 4222, please do not play 3DMs.

Carrizo
Zanetti(c)-Micho-Heinze-Monzón
Masche-Cambiasso
Román-Messi
Aguero-Milito

Wait and see...

[Arg10]

Glad we got the 3 points. Tevez looked like a beast the entire match(especially in the first half, he dominated that left side). Messi, I found had a good game, got kicked around alot. Aguero had a decent match. He got a goal, but let's be honest, that was it. He had a very quiet second half. I would like to see Tevez---Milito---Messi at this point more than Aguero in there.

I might of heard wrong, but the announcers said that Riquelme will miss the Chile match because of the amount of yellow cards he's received? If so, it would seem logical to put in Ledesma and take Riquelme out. Mascherano had a great game. I really thought he was injured in the first half, but man he's a warrior. Burdisso did better than I thought, Demichelis had a good game and Heinze I thought did very well. Zanetti got kicked around a shitload of times.

I'll post a bit more later, just glad we got the 3 points.

[west501]

3 points, just made it at home
I'll give a man by man analysis

Carrizo - solid, not really tested but provided a security in the back line that we haven't seen recently with Pato:eek: in goal..is JP just so much better or are we used to such mediocrity? I think Carrizo deserves a chance to answer this question and that we should never see Pato:eek: in our goal ever again
with Carrizo we would have beaten Paraguay

Zanetti(c) - warrior, he doesn't have what he had 5 years ago physically, but after this match I think he'll make it to 2010
Micho - solid in defence, no complaints
Burdisso - discreet in his role, was there when we needed him
Heinze - solid as well, went up a few times where I wasn't happy to see him have to run back

Masche - give him the armband, the man of the match
Cambiasso - I don't know what it is, but I like his touches into space these days, I actually think he's becoming a more dynamic player/underrated playmaker as time goes on, as well as showing an instinct and desire to go up to score goals..I'm wanting to see him regularly

Riquelme - good assist on the first goal (it was him right?) and he shows that genius transcends poorly trained national and club teams..though he didn't have any energy in the second half and we looked better without him

Messi - genius, give him the 10
Agüero - discreet, got a good poacher's goal and almost got two
Tévez - imo it's a waste of my time to see him on the left wing..he barely pulled out of what would have been a red card challenge and I was calling for Bergessio of all people

subs
Ledesma - looked great, I knew Basile would play him, interesting polyfunctional player..like a right footed Cambiasso
Milito - also looked good, even if he was far from the area too much of the time
Cata Díaz - good thing he wasn't on for long :o

and who could forget the ref
Torres - was absolutely terrible for both sides, inconsistent, erratic, card-happy, lost control completely in the second half in a very poor showing

[Arg10]

So from what I've gathered so far, Tevez and Riquelme are missing for the match against Chile. Riquelme I can do without, since I think we started playing better in the second half once he came off. Tevez is gonna be a loss since he really worked his ass off versus Uruguay. I can see Messi wearing the #10 on Wednesday. Up front, I think we'll see Milito(who for the little time that he was on, played well), Aguero and Messi. Ledesma might play Riquelme's role. There has been no news on Maxi, so my guess is that he'll probably miss the match, but I really want him to play.

[west501]

because of the suspension to Tévez (that's 3 of the last 6 :eek:) and the injury to Agüero possibly keeping him out, Basile has called up José Sand
I underlined that because Basile has called up José Sand
this is obviously the Basile doctrine of calling up 'guys who are playing well'

anyway the match in Santiago will be an interesting battle between 'the players' vs 'the system'
this is being hyped up by the press and in my opinion we will be tactically outmatched in every area of the pitch but can count on 1) the Chileans failing or 2) our individuality overcoming their system
this is a big week for Basile and it's only half over..we didn't play as well as Uruguay played badly on Saturday and the Chileans are just desperate to beat us
they are more than capable, but I'm just hoping that instead of showing up like they did against Colombia that they show up like they did against Brazil ;)

[Arg10]

because of the suspension to Tévez (that's 3 of the last 6 :eek:) and the injury to Agüero possibly keeping him out, Basile has called up José Sand
I underlined that because Basile has called up José Sand
this is obviously the Basile doctrine of calling up 'guys who are playing well'

anyway the match in Santiago will be an interesting battle between 'the players' vs 'the system'
this is being hyped up by the press and in my opinion we will be tactically outmatched in every area of the pitch but can count on 1) the Chileans failing or 2) our individuality overcoming their system
this is a big week for Basile and it's only half over..we didn't play as well as Uruguay played badly on Saturday and the Chileans are just desperate to beat us
they are more than capable, but I'm just hoping that instead of showing up like they did against Colombia that they show up like they did against Brazil ;)

I'm getting nervous just thinking of the match. I really think Bielsa will have Chile up for it and let's face it, at this point... Bielsa>Basile

If Basile was smart, he would of called up Zarate or Higuain from the start instead of calling up San Lorenzo players who have virtually no future with the team. Mascherano and Demichelis(alongside Aguero like you mentioned) are also doubtful for Wednesday's match. Imagine another match without Mascherano:eek:

Other than that, I'm looking forward to a match without Riquelme(granted would of been better if we had a better set of players... Zarate, Higuain, Banega) but I'll take it at this point. I don't want 1 point, I want 3 points on Wednesday and I hope Basile plays for 3 points.

[west501]

I'm getting nervous just thinking of the match. I really think Bielsa will have Chile up for it and let's face it, at this point... Bielsa>Basile

If Basile was smart, he would of called up Zarate or Higuain from the start instead of calling up San Lorenzo players who have virtually no future with the team. Mascherano and Demichelis(alongside Aguero like you mentioned) are also doubtful for Wednesday's match. Imagine another match without Mascherano:eek:

Other than that, I'm looking forward to a match without Riquelme(granted would of been better if we had a better set of players... Zarate, Higuain, Banega) but I'll take it at this point. I don't want 1 point, I want 3 points on Wednesday and I hope Basile plays for 3 points.

your points are well taken, but as I said, Chile hits or misses, hopefully they miss
they will try to impose their very fast tempo and I daresay without Román we may be able to counter
absolutely right that we should not be in such trouble with player choice right now..what this reflects is a callup with no clear backup to the starting players
this would be the perfect situation to see guys like Zarate, Cave, Licha, Pipita, Banega, Lucho, etc
Basile also never plays for one point, before each match he tells the players to 'win'

edit: unconfirmed formation
Iker Carrizo :cool:
Zanetti(c)-Micho-Burdisso-Heinze
Ledesma-Masche-Cambiasso
Messi
Agüero-Milito

[threervana]

Nico to see Monzon's Debut!

[Arg10]

your points are well taken, but as I said, Chile hits or misses, hopefully they miss
they will try to impose their very fast tempo and I daresay without Román we may be able to counter
absolutely right that we should not be in such trouble with player choice right now..what this reflects is a callup with no clear backup to the starting players
this would be the perfect situation to see guys like Zarate, Cave, Licha, Pipita, Banega, Lucho, etc
Basile also never plays for one point, before each match he tells the players to 'win'

edit: unconfirmed formation
Iker Carrizo :cool:
Zanetti(c)-Micho-Burdisso-Heinze
Ledesma-Masche-Cambiasso
Messi
Agüero-Milito

That looks like how it's gonna be. Personally I don't mind it too much, though I would of prefered to see Di Maria in there somewhere(seeing as how Basile completely ignored him versus Peru and Uruguay). It's been a while since we've used a real target man. Messi #10, anyone? Oh and I'm betting money that Basile will sub in Diaz for Milito.

[threervana]

I would love to see Basile sub in Diaz for Milito.In that case we are about to win the game.

[west501]

Jose 'fucking' Sand!
as if we were playing so well that we should give two players who never should have been called up their national team debut! (and again insist with Cata Díaz!)
what the fuck was Basile thinking? this was a very complicated match

http://im.sify.com/sports/images/jul2007/pic2.jpg
con el Coco vacio: fuera Basile

it had to be said



the above was my immediate post-match reaction
I know what Basile was thinking: 'I would have made 11 changes at half time, that's why I put in those two in the second half'
I think we have two options, just after the first round of the world cup qualifiers, with a long break and friendlies to build a new side, he could be sacked
or we wait for things to ultimately get better, qualify, possibly with a playoff (like the last time Basile was trainer :mad::mad::mad:) hopefully not losing 0-5 to Colombia again and hope that Messi doesn't get positive doping in the first round we don't face Rumania in the second round in South Africa :mad:

Argentina has not played this badly since the run up to the 1986 and 1990 world cups
Passarella was in first place most of the time, Bielsa had the top side in the world (one of the best ever), Pekerman lost 1st in the last match
who knows, maybe we'll be shit in qualification and win the world cup, but I said when Basile was hired (before he'd played one match..it's in this thread) that we couldn't win the world cup with him as coach, and I still think the same
if only for that, let's give someone else a try

[msi2]

Abysmal performance yesterday, just saw the match. Truly abysmal.

[Arg10]

First off, congrats to Bielsa. A coach who knows what he's doing.

Now, what the shit was that I saw last night? Why wasn't Di Maria on the bench? Why wasn't Coloccini brought in instead of Diaz? Why the fuck do you take off Diego Milito, who for the little service that he had did well and put in some player who will never have a shot with the National Team? Why don't we have a back-up for Riquelme? Why was Mascherano played out of position? The answer, Basile is an idiot.

"We changed things around in the second half, we tried to be more aggressive, leaving three at the back, but generally they dominated."
You did it the wrong way, assface. Taking off your ONLY #9 for Bergessio(who has NEVER played a match with the NT) is not the way. Cambiasso was having a bad game, but surely taking him off for Sand was a horrible idea.

"We missed Riquelme. Without him, we play in a different manner. I didn't want to play with a 4-4-2 because it isn't my style. Maybe that scheme would have helped us when marking, but I'm only guessing."
That's all you do! Jesus Christ, if that right there doesn't prove that this idiot has no idea what he's doing, I don't know what will.

Guest brings up a very good point. We have not played this badly in a long time. Basile has arguably, the greatest players in the World at his disposal and he knows jack shit. Imagine what Pekerman or Bielsa would do with this team? If anyone thought that we played fantastic in 2006, add in a better Messi, Aguero, an even better Mascherano, Higuain, Zarate, Di Maria and just imagine. Imagine how well Argentina could play if we had any other coach in the World.
Anyone remember what happened the last time Basile was in charge? You know, 1994. I know losing Diego was a huge blow(mentally) to the NT, but we had an All-Star team that year and Basile still didn't know how to deal with the blow. Not only that, we had a horrible qualification for that World Cup. We had to call back Diego to save us, when we had an amazing team. Fact is Basile has lost the team. I'm not sure how many players still respect him or how many still want to play under him, but it can't be much.

I don't want a repeat of 1994. We've said this time and time again, but the Chile match has to be the end of Basile. Getting a draw is one thing and losing is another thing. But losing while playing the way we did is just too much. No disrespect to Bolivia, but we're Argentina, we're not Bolivia. 5 consecutive draws isn't close to being acceptable. Many people will say that South American Qualifiers are extremely difficult and it's true, they are. But we're still a power house(or atleast should be a power house) in South America. That match last night was a culmination of the Basile era. Great players but no direction.

Bring back Pekerman, snatch Bielsa from Chile if you can, hell, I'll take Simeone right now, just get rid of Basile.

[threervana]

It seems Simeone is suffering in River now. Maybe give him more time.

Bielsa or Pekerman, Please Please Please come back!!! I miss U.

[west501]

we are waiting for the word from AFA regarding Basile's future
I am watching live, will keep you posted

edit: Basile has resigned

[Arg10]

About time. Thank you for leading us to a Copa America final? Not sure what else to say.

Any news on who will replace him and when?

[west501]

a bunch of names are being thrown about, all totally and completely unconfirmed: Batista, Simeone, Russo have gotten the most mention (the three of them highly tactical system-based trainers)
this is a very important decision and I expect the proper time will taken to make it
it was a huge mistake to rehire Basile, so they will have added pressure to make the right choice

[Arg10]

a bunch of names are being thrown about, all totally and completely unconfirmed: Batista, Simeone, Russo have gotten the most mention (the three of them highly tactical system-based trainers)
this is a very important decision and I expect the proper time will taken to make it
it was a huge mistake to rehire Basile, so they will have added pressure to make the right choice

I see. Thanks for the information.

Batista might seem like a logical choice considering he won the Olympics and he knows some of the players already. I'm not sold on Simeone. He can't possibly be worse than Basile. Russo not sure either.

Whoever they pick, they better pick well.

[threervana]

Nice Day!!

Any pick is accepted!!!

[west501]

please not Diego, rehire Basile for a 3rd before Diego :o
edit: Checho will work the friendly against Escocia on 19/11
edit2: because I'm bored...

any coach in the world's dream is to have the players Argentina's coach has available to put in his team
what Basile (and his counterpart Dunga) has done is reduce his rich national team to depend on genius from one or two individual players..in other words they don't have a team to put players in
we could field 3 or 4 national teams with completely different starting lineups and qualify for the world cup
Carrizo; Zabaleta-DeMichelis-Heinze-Monzon; Banega-Mascherano-Di María; Messi; Agüero-Crespo
Ustari; Zanetti-Coloccini-Milito-Arca; Maxi-Gago-Escudero; Riquelme; Higuaín-Cavenaghi
Romero; Burdisso-Garay-Gonzalo-Insua; Lucho-Ledesma-Mariano; Aimar; Tévez-Licha
Orion; A.González-Fazio-Pareja-Placente; Sosa-Cambiasso-Santana; D'Alessandro; Zárate-Milito

we've essentially played with no targetman with Basile, yet he had players of the calibre of Crespo (true he is not active), Pipita, Cavegol, Licha López, Milito, and even someone like Pavone
look at the 4th tandem Zárate-Milito, two of the hottest in serie A could play well together

[Arg10]

The first one you wrote should be our actual starting XI right now. You can alternate between Zabaleta and Zanetti, but other than that it looks good. Banega as the playmaker, Di Maria with the attack on the wing, Aguero having an actual #9 in front of him. The fourth one would probably be our weakest one(I don't think Sosa and Santana are National Team material right now), but with a good coach we should still qualify with a team like that.

Anyone hear the rumours about Bianchi? He looks like the leading candidate alongside Russo right now. I think we can take Simeone off the list and Diego will probably be a motivational speaker or something. Which leaves Bianchi, Russo and Batista. The past 2 days has been all Bianchi. I know alot of us have wanted Bianchi for a long time, can this be it? There was an article quoting Crespo as saying that Bianchi would get his vote. Also, it seems like the announcement should be made on Monday.

Also, since I'm bored, here's who I think will make the list in 2010.

Carrizo, Ustari, Romero
Zabaleta, Zanetti, Demichelis, Heinze, Monzon, Milito, Burdisso
Banega, Mascherano, Di Maria, Messi, Maxi, Gago, Riquelme, Aimar, Cambiasso
Aguero, Higuain, Tevez, Crespo

Unless some random goalkeeper suddenly starts playing like superman or someone gets injured, I think those are the 3 goalkeepers that will make the list.

I can't see any coach(whoever it may be) having the guts to pull a Pekerman and leave Zanetti out of the World Cup. Zabaleta would probably be used as his sub(or vice versa). Demichelis and Milito would probably be our pairing in the middle leaving Heinze and Monzon fighting for a spot on the left. Burdisso I can see as a last resort type thing.

Midfield might have some surprises. Maybe Lucho instead of Aimar or something. Mascherano, there's no debate. Di Maria/Maxi on the left with Messi on the right. Riquelme, I believe will still be our #10 in 2010. Up front was a real tough one. If Aguero continues like this, then he's on the list. Higuain I actually think will make the list versus Scotland next month(or France next year at the very latest). Tevez, once he gets out of Manchester should re-find his groove and maybe Crespo if he can get some actual playing time. I would put Aguero and Higuain.

-------------------Carrizo--------------------
Zabaleta---Demichelis---Milito---Heinze/Monzon
---------------Mascherano---------------------
Messi----------------------------Di Maria/Maxi
----------------Riquelme----------------------
-----------------Aguero
---------------------Higuain------------------

I can't see Cavenaghi, Milito or Zarate on the list. Either of them could replace Crespo, but I don't think he could be replaced. When Batigol was in his prime, we had another REAL #9 in Crespo that was ready to overtake Batigol. I'm sorry, but I just can't see Cavenaghi, Milito or Zarate becoming the next big #9. They'll never have Crespo's quality. IF, again, IF Cavenaghi could get a real run with the National Team, then I think he(out of the 3) would probably be the closest. Heck, even Higuain needs to work on his finishing.

This list/line-up is assuming everyone is healthy and no one gets injured.

[Volrath]

Christ I hope it's Bianchi. It would be great to see him sticking it to the Europeans again. He's the best man for the job if we want to lift the world cup in 2010!

[msi2]

I dont know didnt Bianchi flop in Europe? :confused:

The first one you wrote should be our actual starting XI right now. You can alternate between Zabaleta and Zanetti, but other than that it looks good. Banega as the playmaker, Di Maria with the attack on the wing, Aguero having an actual #9 in front of him. The fourth one would probably be our weakest one(I don't think Sosa and Santana are National Team material right now), but with a good coach we should still qualify with a team like that.

Anyone hear the rumours about Bianchi? He looks like the leading candidate alongside Russo right now. I think we can take Simeone off the list and Diego will probably be a motivational speaker or something. Which leaves Bianchi, Russo and Batista. The past 2 days has been all Bianchi. I know alot of us have wanted Bianchi for a long time, can this be it? There was an article quoting Crespo as saying that Bianchi would get his vote. Also, it seems like the announcement should be made on Monday.

Also, since I'm bored, here's who I think will make the list in 2010.

Carrizo, Ustari, Romero
Zabaleta, Zanetti, Demichelis, Heinze, Monzon, Milito, Burdisso
Banega, Mascherano, Di Maria, Messi, Maxi, Gago, Riquelme, Aimar, Cambiasso
Aguero, Higuain, Tevez, Crespo

Unless some random goalkeeper suddenly starts playing like superman or someone gets injured, I think those are the 3 goalkeepers that will make the list.

I can't see any coach(whoever it may be) having the guts to pull a Pekerman and leave Zanetti out of the World Cup. Zabaleta would probably be used as his sub(or vice versa). Demichelis and Milito would probably be our pairing in the middle leaving Heinze and Monzon fighting for a spot on the left. Burdisso I can see as a last resort type thing.

Midfield might have some surprises. Maybe Lucho instead of Aimar or something. Mascherano, there's no debate. Di Maria/Maxi on the left with Messi on the right. Riquelme, I believe will still be our #10 in 2010. Up front was a real tough one. If Aguero continues like this, then he's on the list. Higuain I actually think will make the list versus Scotland next month(or France next year at the very latest). Tevez, once he gets out of Manchester should re-find his groove and maybe Crespo if he can get some actual playing time. I would put Aguero and Higuain.

-------------------Carrizo--------------------
Zabaleta---Demichelis---Milito---Heinze/Monzon
---------------Mascherano---------------------
Messi----------------------------Di Maria/Maxi
----------------Riquelme----------------------
-----------------Aguero
---------------------Higuain------------------

I can't see Cavenaghi, Milito or Zarate on the list. Either of them could replace Crespo, but I don't think he could be replaced. When Batigol was in his prime, we had another REAL #9 in Crespo that was ready to overtake Batigol. I'm sorry, but I just can't see Cavenaghi, Milito or Zarate becoming the next big #9. They'll never have Crespo's quality. IF, again, IF Cavenaghi could get a real run with the National Team, then I think he(out of the 3) would probably be the closest. Heck, even Higuain needs to work on his finishing.

This list/line-up is assuming everyone is healthy and no one gets injured.

Seriously why Tevez or even Higuain have to be necessarily there?
I mean for the former, look at his track record under the NT and his number of goals... rather weak for an alleged 9. For me a 9 this is Batigol or Crespo stats. Even Figueroa has a better game/goal ratio than Tevez. So I wouldnt consider him as a 9, more like as a support striker. And in this area, i'm sorry but there is a huge competition here with Aguero, Lavezzi, Higuain (which also i dont consider him as a true 9), Zarate...

Another player i dont feel comfortable right now is Kun Aguero. He's great with Atletico, but boy does he disappoint under the NT. :(
I wonder if it's the system used by Basile (he was caught saying during the game against Chile that "Aguero es un desastre", which i agree with) that is undermining or simply he doesnt feel it? :confused:

Many questions at less than two years until the next WC. Let's hope a lot of them will find an answer (quickly if possible) during the 2009 with the new DT.

[threervana]

Forget about flop in Europe!!!

Bianchi is God when he coaches Argentinean Team!!!!!!

According to Ole, Bianchi's ideal formation will be traditional 4312 and he also mention some important names in his plan:


GK

RB CB CB Clemente Rodriguez

Veron Mascherano Someone(Probably Gago)

Riquelme

Messi D.Milito/Denis

What's your guys opinions about this?

[msi2]

I have nothing against the 4-3-1-2 but i dont like too much the players used. Oh well, anyway let's see what will happen. Do you have a link please?

[west501]

I'm glad to see some discussion starting around this as it's obvious that Basile's departure is the most exciting thing (by far) that has happened to the side since the fantastic performance at 2006 World Cup

I too am excited about Bianchi and think he'll finally accept the position after turning it down so many times
with Clemente I agree, he is a great left back..put Heinze back in the middle until Milito comes back
with Verón, you can't argue about his age when you look at how he's playing right now..the age factor comes in with the injuries every other week though
the #8 is a squad position that we have several excellent players to fill and I hope he considers Verón along with Lucho, Maxi, Sosa, Zabaleta, and Zanetti
I disagree with Gago, though trust Bianchi to build a good enough team for a player like Gago to thrive
the same goes for the targetman, Bianchi will play with a targetman, even if it means leaving off players like Agüero or Tévez (who are more direct substitutes for Messi)
I think they should play together when Román is subbed off and Messi moves back to the playmaker role
some initial thoughts
I have no reason right now to think of any other candidate, and while I do think an 86 player deserves the chance, Batista needs more experience and Diego, my idol, my beloved favourite player of all time, almost my namesake, a man who's brilliance on the pitch was unrivaled by any player in the history of the game, the coaches bench is off the pitch and Diego doesn't have the head for it.

[Volrath]

Bianchi has experience coaching in Europe, yes he kind of flopped there (Roma, Atlético,...) but who is to say he can't use that to his advantage. He's outwitted European teams in the past (Milan 2x, Real Madrid) and is by far the most qualified manager to lead us to world cup glory imo!

I don't think he'll use Gago in his classic 4-3-1-2 formation, he only plays one pure DM at a time (Masch in this case). Véron as the 8 (Lucho as his sub probably), Masch as the enforcer and Maxi as the right winger. Riquelme as the enganche (with Aimar his natural sub) and upfront Messi and Milito.

Carrizo as the goalie and a Zanetti-Demi-Gonzalo-Cl. Rodriguez backline. Not bad.

[msi2]

Bianchi has experience coaching in Europe, yes he kind of flopped there (Roma, Atlético,...) but who is to say he can't use that to his advantage. He's outwitted European teams in the past (Milan 2x, Real Madrid) and is by far the most qualified manager to lead us to world cup glory imo!

I don't think he'll use Gago in his classic 4-3-1-2 formation, he only plays one pure DM at a time (Masch in this case). Véron as the 8 (Lucho as his sub probably), Masch as the enforcer and Maxi as the right winger. Riquelme as the enganche (with Aimar his natural sub) and upfront Messi and Milito.

Carrizo as the goalie and a Zanetti-Demi-Gonzalo-Cl. Rodriguez backline. Not bad.

Aimar.... :D Obviously when he's not injured... :p

[threervana]

What a pity he is still injuried now...:(

[msi2]

What a pity he is still injuried now...:(

Not only that but he was shitty anyway with Benfica (before he got injured).
Look it's simple about Aimar, the player is simply not reliable and that's why you cant built something around him (and why Valencia sold him).

[threervana]

Not only that but he was shitty anyway with Benfica (before he got injured).
Look it's simple about Aimar, the player is simply not reliable and that's why you cant built something around him (and why Valencia sold him).

But he was the key man in the Lisbon Derby~~:p

[west501]

I don't understand Aimar's decision to move to a club trained by the defensive-minded Sanchez-Flores that essentially forced him out of Valencia

[threervana]

I don't understand Aimar's decision to move to a club trained by the defensive-minded Sanchez-Flores that essentially forced him out of Valencia

yep~Really not a good choice. He should come back to River. :o

[Volrath]

Not only that but he was shitty anyway with Benfica (before he got injured).
Look it's simple about Aimar, the player is simply not reliable and that's why you cant built something around him (and why Valencia sold him).
Ow, I thought he was playing regularly with Benfica now:(

[Arg10]

Ow, I thought he was playing regularly with Benfica now:(

According to wiki, he played 4 games for Benfica before he got injured.

yep~Really not a good choice. He should come back to River.:o

He would be injured within the first 10 seconds. If you thought that Europe was physical, nothing beats South America.

It's sad because when he's 100% healthy, he's the best player out there. I view him like Riquelme, just faster. His vision, his touch... pretty much everything about Aimar is so beautiful to watch.

Seems like the announcement about the new coach should be made on Monday? So tomorrow?

[threervana]

Hope we could welcome our new coach tomorrow~~

[greengo]

looks like Maradona will be the coach, just heard he is talking to Grondona right now :eek:

[msi2]

Boy i hope it's not true!!! :eek::eek::eek:

[greengo]

its official

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5i8MkXWrtYdyfulF9DrWjyUJDarrA

[west501]

noooo

[threervana]

IT'S F@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ING TRUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUE!!!

Oh My God!!oh Our God----DIEGO MARADONA!!!!!

[Arg10]

I'm gonna copy/paste what I wrote in the Football Section and add more to it.
---
I’m 50/50 on this. Diego seems to have completely turned his life around lately and he’s always wanted the National Team job. That and he won’t take shit from anyone in the AFA. The other half of me says he has little to no experience in coaching. I'm reallllllllly not sure about this one.

Is our path to glory through the '86 glory? I hope so.

Due to his past run-ins involving drugs, all proposed friendlies in the United States or Australia have been suspended, as Diego is prohibited from entering either country.

---

I'm not sure what to say. The players picked for 2010 are gonna be motivated like crazy and they have a fire up their asses now. Maradona, Carlos Bilardo, Pedro Troglio, Julio Olarticoechea and Héctor Enrique would form the coaching team.

If that isn't 1986 I don't know what is. It seems like Batista will remain the Youth coach, I think. I don't know. All this talk about Bianchi had me excited(not to say I'm not excited about Diego, but when it comes to coaching Bianchi is years ahead). Our only way to glory in 2010 is through 1986.

[west501]

this does represent Diego's chance at redemption for being such a disgrace in his post playing days
call me cynical but I just don't believe in anything he's done off the pitch

[greengo]

if Dunga can, why not Maradona :D both never coached before

[west501]

Maradona has coached before, he was worse than Dunga :eek::mad:

[Arg10]

To be fair to Maradona, he wasn't exactly coaching "top class" teams. Either way, it'll be interesting.

[west501]

To be fair to Maradona, he wasn't exactly coaching "top class" teams. Either way, it'll be interesting.

Dunga is coaching a top-class team
interesting it will be, my rational side is angry but my Diego worshipping side roots for 'the appointment of God' or 'the trainer of God' or simply 'God's team'

[threervana]

I just know that winning number of Diego's coaching record will change.:)

[west501]

yes, Diego will probably win at least one match with Argentina :p

[Arg10]

I'm willing to give Diego the benefit of the doubt. Got this part from an article online.

Maradona admitted that he has to put a "winning mentality" into the heads of all Argentine players, those who ply their trade in the domestic Argentine competition, as well as those in Europe.

Something Basile couldn't do. Already, Diego 1 - Basile 0.

[msi2]

yes, Diego will probably win at least one match with Argentina :p

Well Basile had a hard time doing this lately. :p

[west501]

noooo


sorry mates, I had another panic reaction there..River sucks and AFA made the wrong choice, it's a bad week for the football section of my brain and my blood pressure just shot up considerably
I think I need a break

[threervana]

Just go to bed.

After waking up, support and pray for Diego as much as you can!

[Arg10]

In any case...
http://www.26noticias.com.ar/asi-formaria-la-nueva-seleccion-de-maradona-77321.html

He pretty much states that Zanetti's era is done with the National Team alongside Cambiasso. It looks like he's planning on using Di Maria as the playmaker?

Carizzo
Angeleri, Demichelis, Heinze, Papa
Mascherano, Gago
Di Maria
Messi, Tevez, Aguero

[msi2]

In any case...
http://www.26noticias.com.ar/asi-formaria-la-nueva-seleccion-de-maradona-77321.html

He pretty much states that Zanetti's era is done with the National Team alongside Cambiasso. It looks like he's planning on using Di Maria as the playmaker?

Carizzo
Angeleri, Demichelis, Heinze, Papa
Mascherano, Gago
Di Maria
Messi, Tevez, Aguero


To me:

-------------Carizzo----------------

Angeleri -Demichelis - Heinze - Papa

--------Mascherano----Gago-------

----Messi-----------------Di Maria--

--------Aguero--------Tevez-------

Would make more sense to me.

[threervana]

New RB & LB~~Not Bad~
No Zanetti, Burdisso, Cambiasso and Roman???!!!.....

[msi2]

To me:

-------------Carizzo----------------

Angeleri -Demichelis - Heinze - Papa

--------Mascherano----Gago-------

----Messi-----------------Di Maria--

--------Aguero--------Tevez-------

Would make more sense to me.

Well now thinking about it, i really doubt he's going to dump Roman. The media would have gone ballistic about it. :D

[threervana]

Diego always loves Roman~~:)

But he also loves a bunch of players.

[west501]

it's the players he hates I'm more worried about
from the outset all I can say is at least he loves Masche and agrees he's our most important player
I honestly hope he gives him the armband for the World Cup (provided we/he make it that far)
Juampa Carrizo would make a good alternate

[msi2]

What are the players he hates?

[threervana]

What are the players he hates?

I wanna know,2.

From his lineup we might know that he hates Cambiasso????:confused:

[msi2]

Looks like Higuain is not going to be in Maradona's papers anytime soon. :p

[threervana]

Looks like Higuain is not going to be in Maradona's papers anytime soon. :p

why??? Diego doen't like him~:confused:

[msi2]

why??? Diego doen't like him~:confused:

Apparently (from Marca), he didnt like the fact Higuain refused to go to the sub-20 WC last year because he wanted to rest...

Also, i have read a similar story for the Olympics Games, he was called by Batista but then Real Madrid opposed his departure because they wanted him to do the preseason and let's say that Higuain didnt really show concerns about not going to Beijing (unlike Messi).

Though this has to be taken with a grain of salt.

[threervana]

Apparently (from Marca), he didnt like the fact Higuain refused to go to the sub-20 WC last year because he wanted to rest...

Also, i have read a similar story for the Olympics Games, he was called by Batista but then Real Madrid opposed his departure because they wanted him to do the preseason and let's say that Higuain didnt really show concerns about not going to Beijing (unlike Messi).

Though this has to be taken with a grain of salt.


http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/11/01/seleccion/01793454.html

I guess Higuain still have chance.

[Arg10]

Carrizo

Burdisso, Demichelis, Heinze, Angeleri, Papa

Mascherano, Gago, Di Maria, Maxi

Messi, Lavezzi, Aguero, Denis

Those are pretty much all the names that have been thrown out there ever since Diego got appointed. Also, it looks like Diego is planning on playing with 3 at the back instead of 4. And with the names mentioned, we get something like this.

----------------Carrizo-----------------

Burdisso-------Demichelis---------Heinze

---------------Mascherano--------------

Maxi--------------Gago----------Di Maria

Messi------------Aguero----------Lavezzi


Alternate Lavezzi with Tevez and Aguero with Higuain and thats pretty much it. I'm assuming Riquelme would get a spot once he actually starts playing well(if he ever finds his form back).

Problem with 3 at the back means that Maxi and Di Maria are going to have to back track alot and I just can't see Di Maria tracking back. Maxi maybe, because with Basile he's played deep in the field before. Thats when we miss someone like Sorin. Sorin was a machine on the left. He would defend and attack, run up and down the pitch and wouldn't get tired. Another problem is that all three, Burdisso, Demichelis and Heinze are all slow. And that can really be a problem, counter attack or not. I still can't understand why another coach would use Aguero as a direct #9. Aguero isn't good at it. He needs to play with a target man and right now it looks like it might be Higuain. I'll stop now before I go overboard with other formations, especially considering that the formation I wrote down might not even be close to the one that Diego will form.

[west501]

let the infighting begin: Maradona isolates himself from Batista and Brown (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/11/04/seleccion/01795587.html)
http://www.ole.clarin.com/diario/2008/11/04/seleccion/thumb/tapa.jpg

Maradona scandal #1
I am adding a 4th column to Maradona's totals as trainer
W-D-L-S
so far he is 0-0-0-1
at the moment I don't want to detract points but you have to think that the numbers to the left will be influenced as the Scandal number goes up
he hasn't even been officially announced yet and Grondona is irate, though Don Julio only has himself to blame for making such a poor choice

[Arg10]

The list is out!
http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/11/04/seleccion/01795816.html

Carrizo, Sergio Romero
Zanetti, Demichelis, Heinze, Cata Diaz, Burdisso, Coloccini
Jonas Gutierrez, Lucho Gonzalez, Gago, Mascherano, Maxi Rodriguez, Sosa, Di Maria
Aguero, Tevez, Lisandro Lopez, Denis, Lavezzi

Interesting list. Despite everything, Zanetti is in(Cambiasso isn't). Lucho is back and Lopez is in there alongside Lavezzi:)!

I'll post a shitload more later.

[threervana]

It looks like Coco's list,isn't it?

[Arg10]

It looks like Coco's list,isn't it?

I wouldn't go that far. The defense yeah, I do agree. Burdisso I have no idea why he's still in there(he's been absolutely horrible this season) and Heinze isn't exactly our best defender. I would of loved to have seen Zabaleta, Monzon and Rodriguez(the man is a beast with Villarreal). So yes, our defense does need work.

Midfield looks about good to me. Gutierrez had a very good match last night and has surprised me the few times he's played with Argentina(especially versus Brazil), Gonzalez I think is finally getting his last real chance and lets face it Coco didn't exactly use him to his full potential, Gago, Mascherano, Maxi and Di Maria I was expecting. Sosa I wasn't. I have no idea who you would want to see in the midfield that wasn't picked. And if someone says Buonanotte I'll laugh because the guy would get killed against a physical team like Scotland. There's also the home-based group of players(usually around 3) and it looks like Riquelme will get called up(depending on how Boca does in the Sudamericana).

Up front however, I do have a problem with Tevez. Ever since moving to United, I find that he's lost his touch. When he played in Argentina and Brazil he was taking on defenders no problem, now he has trouble taking on one defender. He used to be a goal scoring machine, now he's just a machine that runs around the MIDFIELD trying to get back the ball. I was expecting Higuain or Zarate instead of Tevez. Aguero is no surprise. Glad to see Lopez and Lavezzi getting their chance. I'll be the first to admit I've never liked Denis, ever. Not sure how much playing time he'll get(if any).

In total, I would of liked to have seen:
Zabaleta, Monzon, Rodriguez, Higuain and Cavenaghi. But with our front line being as competitive as it is, some players will have to be off the list and in this case, Higuain and Cavenaghi. But there is no excuse with leaving Zabaleta, Monzon and Rodriguez out.

[msi2]

...and Pareja por favor!

Not realy thrilled by the presence of Sosa, es un muerto.

PS to argentine coaches: Gonzalo Rodriguez is an argentinian player, not uruguayan. :rolleyes:

...and i agree with you on Tevez. There has been an horrible trade-off since is evolving in England. He seems to have gained a lot of power but lost a lot of his ability to dribble and pace. He seems a lot slower now than he was before. Bleh, i dont like at all what kind of player he has become.

Why not Piatti* (he scored this week), Belluschi instead of Sosa? I'm not talking about Aimar because he just came back from injury and i would like to see if he can go on a couple of games without being injured.

[west501]

Messi should be there for Maradona's debut
what was Grondona thinking? (I know I ask this a lot lately)
apparently we will play with a line of 4 in Scotland, so Zanetti is called up
still, 3r is correct and a lot of criticism is aimed at the Basile-like choices in this list
but let's not forget that Maradona loved Basile's Boca and called el Cata Díaz one of the best defenders in the world (http://www.clarin.com/diario/2005/08/20/deportes/d-07701.htm)..this is a disgrace, el Cata is terrible..are we to see Battaglia make a comeback while Cambiasso, who is arguably playing his best football is taken off the list?? we are yet to play in La Paz, Quito, Asuncion, and Montevideo..are we to make the world cup??
Heinze and Burdisso are not playing national team football right now, why choose them over Gonzalo or even Pareja?
Tévez should not be there, and Denis over Mauro Zárate?
sorry but I can't stop the negativity..maybe a formation will cheer me

JP 'Obama' Carrizo :cool::rolleyes:
Zanetti(c)-Coloccini-Micho-Heinze
Masche-Gago
Maxi-DiMaría
Lavezzi-Agüero

[msi2]

Well Cata Diaz isnt that bad. His appearances were decent with no major crap to be reported on his side.

[threervana]

Not a list will satisfy everyone,right?

And I don't think el Cata is terrible as well, although I regard Gonzalo or Garay as a more promising option.

Base on this list, possible lineup will be the one Ole mentioned before:
Carrizo

Burdisso(Diaz) Demichelis Heinze(Coloccini)

Maxi(Pupi) Mascherano Gago(Lucho) Di Maria(Jonas)

Tevez (Sosa)

Aguero(Lisandro) Lavezzi(Denis)

P.S It will change as some local players might be called up later. But I think this list is strong enough to deal with a friendly.

[west501]

just like Denis, I don't think Cata deserves to wear the national team shirt :eek:
in the news Diego has convinced Masche to wear the armband (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/11/10/seleccion/01800063.html) http://fbtz.com/forum/images/icons/icon14.gif
he is going to talk to Román to come but will let the Estudiantes players (presumably Verón and Angeleri) off because they've an important cup match
regarding Milito (3goals on the weekend), Higuaín (4 goals on the weekend :D), and Zárate (also scored) he says that as long as they keep it up they'll get their chance
Ruggeri is apparently first on the list, while Batista and Brown's involvement still in serious doubt/question (even though it was apparently a condition for Diego's appointment)
last week Diego asked that Messi at least be allowed to travel with the squad to Scotland (I'm still very upset over the 'deal' that AFA has made limiting Messi from important friendlies)
more news will undoubtedly come this week leading up to next week's match as la Argentina de D10S begins to take shape
gotta say I'm nervous

[threervana]

gotta say I'm more and more excited each day~~

The reason why Denis is selected over Milito, Zarate, Higuain is probably he plays for Napoli~~HAHa

And I wonder how Lisandro is doing now??? Better than Milito, Zarate or Higuain??

[DSGB]

There has to be some sort of grudge against Higuaín at this point. Playing as well as he is for a club like Real Madrid, there could be no other reason not to see him even sitting on the bench for us. Hopefully whatever it is will pass and we can see him have his chance with the team.

[threervana]

There has to be some sort of grudge against Higuaín at this point. Playing as well as he is for a club like Real Madrid, there could be no other reason not to see him even sitting on the bench for us. Hopefully whatever it is will pass and we can see him have his chance with the team.

I hear that Diego won't call players who rejected our blue and white jersey once and Unfortunately, Higuain did reject when he was called up by U20...

Never say no to this jersey!!

[Arg10]

Higuain will get his chance. When Diego travelled to Europe last week he ended up talking to Gago, Heinze and Higuain. Afterwards he said that if Higuain, Zarate and Milito continue scoring they will get their chance. So I'm not worried about Higuain. Yes, Higuain didn't want to play in the U20 World Cup last summer, but he did play an U23 friendly versus Guatemala(where he scored 2 goals) and he has stated many times that he would love to play with Argentina. Also I've been thinking this for a while and I think Higuain will finally get his call against none other than France(where he was born). Hopefully he would be able to top it off with a goal!

In other news, Di Maria is injured and will miss the match against Scotland. And it looks like Diego is trying to convince Barcelona to let Messi travel with the team to Scotland, not play, just travel. But no news on the decision.

And the big news is that Mascherano is now captain. I have nothing against it but I don't find it right. I mean Zanetti is still with the team and taking the captain's armband away from him when he's still playing... I don't know, I don't like the decision. But of course when Zanetti is not there/retires Mascherano gets my vote. Oh and Burdisso got injured while training(from what I've read). Not sure if this means he'll play versus Scotland or not.

Edit: I knew I forgot something, here's the list of domestic players called up.

Montenegro, Papa and Villagra.

http://www.afa.org.ar/?m=news&n=7779

[west501]

Higuaín was ineligible for the U20 squad at the time because he only held a French passeport, and he declined the callup because getting his Argentine passport would have invalidated his French nationality and put in jeopardy his big plans to play in Europe (he would have been a sub anyway with Zárate and Agüero there)
eventually he was able to get dual citizenship
in retrospect it was a good decision because Madrid wouldn't want a foreign non-starting player and today he may have been at a relatively minor club where his chances wouldn't be as good as they are today
I am confident we'll see him before too long

as for the captaincy, Ayala and Zanetti had shared it under Bielsa and Pekerman kept them in the squad when he made Sorín captain (well until the WC :eek::mad:)
I don't see a problem with taking the armband from Zanetti while keeping him in the squad, even if el más grande is just opening the door for him to retire
I do think that el Pupi should be given a chance to retire after the next world cup though..even if he is just a squad player, because he was the Masche of the previous generation

as for the Buenos Aires based callups, Montenegro I like, Papa I'd like to see, but Villagra? come on, that is not a player who should wear the national team shirt..just like Marco Ruben or el Cata Díaz
that said, play him over Heinze, please :o

edit: also Piatti has been playing well, even if it is on a shite team he will probably move next season, you could put an 18 on him and the Scots would think he was Messi :o
that brings up another issue, is el 10 going to give Messi la 10, uuuuu what a question :o
btw did anyone else notice who had the 10 against Chile? (http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/preliminaries/southamerica/matches/round=250491/match=300035315/report.html) and you wonder why Messi asked for a change :eek:

[msi2]

Villagra?????????????????


POR FAVOR!!! :eek::mad:

[threervana]

Take it easy, men~~He just go to the training~~

I would love to see Papa starting as our LB~~

[Arg10]

http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/11/12/seleccion/01801450.html

From what I can understand and from what I'm reading elsewhere, Maradona met with Grondona and they talked about the coaching staff. In short, Maradona wants Oscar Ruggeri as his assistant, Grondona said no, Maradona said yes, Grondona said no, Maradona said it's Ruggeri or he quits.:eek:

[west501]

this is a national embarrassment
let's go ahead and get another one into the scandals column
Diego's record so far: 0-0-0-2
2 backroom scandals before even playing the first match!
imagine what will happen when he meets the players and what if we lose or don't play well?
how low can we go??

[Arg10]

this is a national embarrassment
let's go ahead and get another one into the scandals column
Diego's record so far: 0-0-0-2
2 backroom scandals before even playing the first match!
imagine what will happen when he meets the players and what if we lose or don't play well?
how low can we go??

Not sure you can blame this entirely on Diego though. More like 50/50. We all know Grondona and how pretty much the AFA is mafia run. Combine that with the fact that Diego doesn't take shit from anyone and something like this was bound to happen.

[west501]

Not sure you can blame this entirely on Diego though. More like 50/50. We all know Grondona and how pretty much the AFA is mafia run. Combine that with the fact that Diego doesn't take shit from anyone and something like this was bound to happen.

that's fair enough, but it's Diego's lack of professionalism that upsets me
he was hired with the condition that the very able Batista, who led the players to the Gold with his assistant el Tata Brown, would be on the bench with him and he probably just yes-d Grondona and now he's singing another song
Diego has a God complex and even if he admits his incompetence as a coach he still wants to control what he admitted was his weakness
I think this is a very bad situation because if he gets Ruggeri it will be appeasing him and if he gets stuck with Batista and Brown there will be tension
overall I just think it's for the bad of the team and that's all I cared about since he was appointed
let him coach Boquita :rolleyes:

[threervana]

Okay ~~~Diego out and Viceroy in~~~Joking~~

[Arg10]

Random news before the weekend matches.

Diego Milito scored the only goal for Genoa against Juventus(Juventus won 4-1).

Sorin still isn't at 100% and might miss the rest of the season(he's back with Cruzeiro with only 3 matches left in the season). He's 32, will be 34 during the World Cup. The reason why I brought him up is because if he does re-find his form, what are the odds of seeing him in 2010 if we don't find a REAL left back? Heinze isn't cutting it anymore.

Crespo is being linked to Real Madrid and so is Julio Cruz. Crespo has the better chance since he isn't cup tied(he can play for Madrid in the CL since he wasn't in Mourinho's list for the CL so far). But who knows.

Oh and can someone please tell Saviola to get the hell out of Madrid? He's wasting his talent on the bench. Go to Italy, Germany, France, elsewhere in Spain, even go back to River just PLAY.

[deviant]

Oh and can someone please tell Saviola to get the hell out of Madrid? He's wasting his talent on the bench. Go to Italy, Germany, France, elsewhere in Spain, even go back to River just PLAY.

I dont see where exactly you would fit him anyways Aguero and Messi should lead the front

[msi2]

that's fair enough, but it's Diego's lack of professionalism that upsets me
he was hired with the condition that the very able Batista, who led the players to the Gold with his assistant el Tata Brown, would be on the bench with him and he probably just yes-d Grondona and now he's singing another song
Diego has a God complex and even if he admits his incompetence as a coach he still wants to control what he admitted was his weakness
I think this is a very bad situation because if he gets Ruggeri it will be appeasing him and if he gets stuck with Batista and Brown there will be tension
overall I just think it's for the bad of the team and that's all I cared about since he was appointed
let him coach Boquita :rolleyes:

Well actually, he never said he would quit, typical ole journalist hyperbole.

[west501]

Well actually, he never said he would quit, typical ole journalist hyperbole.

that was quite obvious from the beginning
I was just talking about Diego's conflictive nature
my biggest fear when he was hired was that infighting would undermine the team and the only thing I respected was his admittance of his weakness and his taking on a capable team of assistants

but I begin to understand their thinking here
the one thing Diego has done well is make sure to cover his weaknesses by surrounding himself with an incredibly capable staff
I consider this a constitutional monarchy, with Diego as a figurehead with an able Prime Minister in Bilardo and a fantastic Parliament in Brown, Batista, etc
man though, Diego is going to be one Queen/God Bitch

now, after a little over a week, he's had a taste of power and he's trying his best to abuse it
if he gets his way it will likely be a very weak dictatorship and that worries me very much :(

[Nelly]

The Argentine squad are staying at the Hotel where my wife is working.:) I'm off work the next three days and will be taking the chance to go and see if I can make an aquaintance or two.Shit....I feel dumb.Even though I'm older than most of the squad I feel like these guys are all so........arrgh,I dunno what I mean.Starstruck? Envious?

A few teams have passed through the hotel in recent years and all are lousy tippers apparently.:eek::D

[west501]

The Argentine squad are staying at the Hotel where my wife is working.:) I'm off work the next three days and will be taking the chance to go and see if I can make an aquaintance or two.Shit....I feel dumb.Even though I'm older than most of the squad I feel like these guys are all so........arrgh,I dunno what I mean.Starstruck? Envious?

A few teams have passed through the hotel in recent years and all are lousy tippers apparently.:eek::D

guau that's cool, mate :cool:
a few years ago I took a Lan flight from Santiago to Buenos Aires with Carlos Bianchi
he was in the row in front of me......except that he was in the last row of 1st class and I was in the first row of the rest of the plane :o
some people spoke to him and got autographs at the baggage check
I thought about it, but decided against it
I'm not one to get starstruck really

[Arg10]

guau that's cool, mate :cool:
a few years ago I took a Lan flight from Santiago to Buenos Aires with Carlos Bianchi
he was in the row in front of me......except that he was in the last row of 1st class and I was in the first row of the rest of the plane :o
some people spoke to him and got autographs at the baggage check
I thought about it, but decided against it
I'm not one to get starstruck really

Thats pretty sick. I would of tried to get an autograph.

So Diego held his first training session and I guess it went good. No one got injured. He hasn't hinted at a formation or starting XI or anything like that. Only thing we know is that Carrizo and Mascherano will start:p

[west501]

apparently Román will get the 10 and Messi will be polyfunctional..of course they won't be playing on Thursday :eek:
does anyone know if Messi is concentrating with the team anyway? (Nelly is la Pulga at the hotel?)
I am very interested to know what the formation will be (Nelly can you position yourself in the ventilation system to try to overhear chatter about the formation? don't ask el 10 directly, he may shoot you with an air rifle)
glad that JP '007' Carrizo and our new capitan Masche will be playing
I would also expect to see Agüero partner with Tévez and hope to see Maxi and/or Lucho in there..don't be surprised to see Montenegro
the only ones I really don't want to see are Cata and Villagra

[Arg10]

apparently Román will get the 10 and Messi will be polyfunctional..of course they won't be playing on Thursday :eek:
does anyone know if Messi is concentrating with the team anyway? (Nelly is la Pulga at the hotel?)
I am very interested to know what the formation will be (Nelly can you position yourself in the ventilation system to try to overhear chatter about the formation? don't ask el 10 directly, he may shoot you with an air rifle)
glad that JP '007' Carrizo and our new capitan Masche will be playing
I would also expect to see Agüero partner with Tévez and hope to see Maxi and/or Lucho in there..don't be surprised to see Montenegro
the only ones I really don't want to see are Cata and Villagra

From what I read la Pulga won't be heading to Scotland(Guardiola said that earlier this week). Apparently Messi came out and said something to the press that Guaridola didn't like or something like that. And afterwards Guardiola said that Messi won't travel to Scotland.

I too expect to see Aguero and Tevez up front and I would like to see Lucho as the playmaker in there somewhere.

[west501]

I like what Diego had to say about Messi
he wants him to be more of a creator of play
to draw defenders like few others can and let someone else finish
that's very much like the role that Diego himself had
Pekerman couldn't fit Messi into the team, Basile couldn't build a team around Messi, Diego has the right idea but I doubt he has the coaching ability to get the results
to quote Richard Ashcroft 'I never pray but tonight I'm on my knees'
yeah..
I'm also furious Messi won't be travelling, much less playing with the squad until March :eek:

[deviant]

Not everyday does the greatest show up for your training session.
http://i.media.goal.com/g/38983.jpg

[west501]

some bad news (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/11/18/seleccion/01805510.html): Giannina Maradona has had complications with her pregnancy and el Kun Agüero has left the concentration to be with her (in Madrid). This appears to be a preventative measure and the baby is healthy. Still, everything aside I wish the best to the three of them, as well as their families in this difficult time.

and because a formation is being thrown around
edit: all but confirmed
JP 'The One' Carrizo :cool:
Zanetti-Demichelis-Heinze-Papa
Maxi-Mascherano(c)-Gago-J.Gutierrez
Tévez-Lavezzi*

*replacing, it almost goes without saying, el Kun

looks like we are nothing but doubts on that left side, eh?
obviously you have to think the formation would change with an enganche/trequartista
I assume with Messi and Riquelme we will look more like the 4-5-1 in the Olympics
that 1 is very important, will it be Tévez, Agüero, Crespo, Cavegol, Milito, Zárate, Higuaín, Messi himself?

[threervana]

On the left side, I definitely wil choose Papa and J.Gutierrez. Made in Velez~~

Lucho plays better in the middle now~

[Nelly]

Diego can speak English!!! Not much but he can.....never knew that although it seems quite reasonable to think that he'd know a few words.

He was joking with the Polish house keeping staff at the hotel.....in English!:D

[sportsmen]

He was joking with the Polish house keeping staff at the hotel.....in English!:D
What is strange about that? It would be funny if he joked with the Polish staff in Polish ;).

[Nelly]

What is strange about that? It would be funny if he joked with the Polish staff in Polish ;).
I wouldn't have known what they were saying then.....when I say me,I mean my missus.:)

Yeah.....I've never heard Maradona speaking English before.Imagine him cracking jokes in Polish? Bizarre.

[west501]

what was he saying?

[Nelly]

One of the Polish girls was giving it all the customer service crap....anything you need just cal me etc etc etc......Diego was saying okay,thank you,will do etc. The Polish girl started talking to her colleagues in Polish rather excitedly,as would happen - It's Diego Maradona ffs!.....when Diego starts giving a Polish impersonation.The girl looked sheepishly at Maradona,who thought he was being funny and he said don't worry,I'm only joking,just a bit of fun,thanks for your help/welcome sort of thing.

This was relayed by my missus who couldn't give a flying fuck about Maradona,Football or the Polish girl(she's lazy,apparently)

[west501]

One of the Polish girls was giving it all the customer service crap....anything you need just cal me etc etc etc......Diego was saying okay,thank you,will do etc. The Polish girl started talking to her colleagues in Polish rather excitedly,as would happen - It's Diego Maradona ffs!.....when Diego starts giving a Polish impersonation.The girl looked sheepishly at Maradona,who thought he was being funny and he said don't worry,I'm only joking,just a bit of fun,thanks for your help/welcome sort of thing.

This was relayed by my missus who couldn't give a flying fuck about Maradona,Football or the Polish girl(she's lazy,apparently)

jajaja I fucking knew it :eek::o
I was going to respond to sportsmen's post saying Diego would more likely making fun of Polish language than speaking it
too bad I lost that opportunity to call it :(:rolleyes:

edit: how about this classic video of Diego having a laugh at the English (http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Diego-Maradona-Dents-English-World-Cup-Pride-in-Press-Conference-Before-Scotland-Friendly/Article/200811315154384?lpos=UK_News_Top_Stories_Header_4&lid=ARTICLE_15154384_Diego_Maradona_Dents_English_ World_Cup_Pride_in_Press_Conference_Before_Scotlan d_Friendly) :cool:

[msi2]

I like what Diego had to say about Messi
he wants him to be more of a creator of play


I'm wondering how Diego will do this...

[west501]

and me too
he certainly won't get the chance to see Messi play until March :eek::mad::mad:, so whatever work he does building a team will have to pretty much start right then

I watched the match the other day (though I fell asleep during the second half :rolleyes:)
didn't look good didn't look bad
el Pupi was amazing and remains our choice wing back
my favourite player by far though, Maxi Rodriguez
if we have one player besides Masche and Carrizo who plays every match, it has to be Maxi
if there are two strikers, he is the third
if there are two central mids, he is the third
Papa, Cata, Gago, and Jonas didn't look like players I want to see in the starting 11 (Cata should not be called up again)

[Arg10]

and me too
he certainly won't get the chance to see Messi play until March :eek::mad::mad:, so whatever work he does building a team will have to pretty much start right then

I watched the match the other day (though I fell asleep during the second half :rolleyes:)
didn't look good didn't look bad
el Pupi was amazing and remains our choice wing back
my favourite player by far though, Maxi Rodriguez
if we have one player besides Masche and Carrizo who plays every match, it has to be Maxi
if there are two strikers, he is the third
if there are two central mids, he is the third
Papa, Cata, Gago, and Jonas didn't look like players I want to see in the starting 11 (Cata should not be called up again)

Yeah, it sucks that we can't see Messi until atleast March. But it was the only way Bareclona would let him go to the Olympics. That and he does get some rest and lets us try out other players so it's not too bad.

Zanetti is a legend. Pure, pure class. Maxi, I said this a while back. Under Pekerman(and now under Maradona), he's virtually a third striker. Basile rarely called him up and it's not because of injuries. Maxi was out for 6 months, not 2 and a half year. Eugh, Basile:( He's so flexible, like you said. He can help out in the midfield and the attack.

I have to agree about Gago. I thought for the most part he played well, Papa did ok considering it was only his debut and all. Cata, there has to be someone better and Gutierrez really faded in the match. He played well versus Brazil, though. I'm still willing to get him another chance.

Considering we won without Messi, Riquelme, Di Maria and Aguero, I would say we did pretty good. We defended as a team and attacked as a team which is something that Basile couldn't do.

[msi2]

and me too
he certainly won't get the chance to see Messi play until March :eek::mad::mad:, so whatever work he does building a team will have to pretty much start right then

I watched the match the other day (though I fell asleep during the second half :rolleyes:)
didn't look good didn't look bad
el Pupi was amazing and remains our choice wing back
my favourite player by far though, Maxi Rodriguez
if we have one player besides Masche and Carrizo who plays every match, it has to be Maxi
if there are two strikers, he is the third
if there are two central mids, he is the third
Papa, Cata, Gago, and Jonas didn't look like players I want to see in the starting 11 (Cata should not be called up again)

What would be your ideal formation?

Yeah, it sucks that we can't see Messi until atleast March. But it was the only way Bareclona would let him go to the Olympics. That and he does get some rest and lets us try out other players so it's not too bad.

Zanetti is a legend. Pure, pure class. Maxi, I said this a while back. Under Pekerman(and now under Maradona), he's virtually a third striker. Basile rarely called him up and it's not because of injuries. Maxi was out for 6 months, not 2 and a half year. Eugh, Basile:( He's so flexible, like you said. He can help out in the midfield and the attack.

I have to agree about Gago. I thought for the most part he played well, Papa did ok considering it was only his debut and all. Cata, there has to be someone better and Gutierrez really faded in the match. He played well versus Brazil, though. I'm still willing to get him another chance.

Considering we won without Messi, Riquelme, Di Maria and Aguero, I would say we did pretty good. We defended as a team and attacked as a team which is something that Basile couldn't do.

About Cata, there is Samuel who apparently is doing an excellent come back, maybe should be considered again (maybe el pupi could touch one word or two about him to Diego).
Demichelis got injured, Di Maria and as well as Messi too. Aguero is not at 100%. Wow lots of injuries.

EDIT:

And yes, Maxi Rodriguez is awesome. One of the most underratted player ever imo.
However, Tevez was a truly a mixed bag again. Sure he has heart but lots of waste in his game too.

[threervana]

and me too

Papa, Cata, Gago, and Jonas didn't look like players I want to see in the starting 11 (Cata should not be called up again)

Cata didn't start...:D Jonas assisted and Papa was stable:) in this game~

Gago will probably start almost every game in future cos Diego loves him:cool:

[deviant]

face it Gago will start every single game dont be a hater :p

[west501]

you might be right though I think it's safe to say that at 22 Gago is not turning into Redondo, but is more like Guti (a talented but controversial love/hate player)
Cambiasso is in some form right now, playing the best football of his life for Inter and was one of the few players who functioned well under Basile

[msi2]

you might be right though I think it's safe to say that at 22 Gago is not turning into Redondo, but is more like Guti (a talented but controversial love/hate player)
Cambiasso is in some form right now, playing the best football of his life for Inter and was one of the few players who functioned well under Basile

Cambiasso functionning well under Basile? :confused::eek:

Wow i thought he was definitely one of the worst.

[threervana]

Cambiasso functionning well under Basile? :confused::eek:

Wow i thought he was definitely one of the worst.

I think so,2.

Especially when Basile put him on the left side.

[west501]

you might be right about that when he was played on the left flank, but in the final days of Basile when he was played in his natural position he was much better
imo Gago is not there yet and should be a sub for Cambiasso, battling it out with Banega
the dupla-central in the midfield is going to be very important going forward and Gago loses too many balls in dangerous positions for my liking

[threervana]

the dupla-central in the midfield is going to be very important going forward and Gago loses too many balls in dangerous positions for my liking

That's true. Gago has to focus in the game more and improve his lousy shooting skills when going forward~

[deviant]

Gago shouldnt shoot at all he should focus on pass and tackling....... He must be given the chance and he will only get better with the experience during the campaign, remember me around 2010 he will be one of the best.

[threervana]

Gago shouldnt shoot at all he should focus on pass and tackling....... He must be given the chance and he will only get better with the experience during the campaign, remember me around 2010 he will be one of the best.

He has focused enough on passing and tackling since I watched him playing in Boca from 2005. He needs to improve his shortcomings (Shooting when given chances, losing the ball carelessly and physique probably) in order to become one of the best DM in 2010.:D

[msi2]

you might be right about that when he was played on the left flank, but in the final days of Basile when he was played in his natural position he was much better


When he played in his natural position?

He has focused enough on passing and tackling since I watched him playing in Boca from 2005. He needs to improve his shortcomings (Shooting when given chances, losing the ball carelessly and physique probably) in order to become one of the best DM in 2010.:D

About the shooting issue, he has indeed this problem. Still not enough confidence in him. For sure he's not Veron yet.

However he's not the only one in the NT. I think overall our players dont shoot enough.

But Cambiasso never left me a strong ever since Pekerman took him back then imo.
The same with Luis Gonzalez.

Hell i would even prefer by a long shot a return of La brujita Veron.
What a player!

[west501]

When he played in his natural position?



About the shooting issue, he has indeed this problem. Still not enough confidence in him. For sure he's not Veron yet.

However he's not the only one in the NT. I think overall our players dont shoot enough.

But Cambiasso never left me a strong ever since Pekerman took him back then imo.
The same with Luis Gonzalez.

Hell i would even prefer by a long shot a return of La brujita Veron.
What a player!

when Cambiasso played more central, when we had an actual left midfielder there (note that with Pekerman we didn't have anyone to the left, but had Sorín go up that way and Riquelme drift left a lot)
I know people think I'm harsh on Gago, but I complained a lot about him (as did others) during the olympics while others gave him the motm it must be said
we won that tournament because no team was capable enough to take advantage of the gap between Gago/Masche and our defence
unless we are lucky enough to face the kind of opposition Brazil did in 2002, we won't be able to win the world cup unless we improve there and imo reinstating that partnership is a step in the wrong direction
but then Diego is not here to improve us tactically, but rather to inject the side with the kind of urgency that led us to 2 arguably undeserved finals

edit: I'd also like to see Verón back and think we will if he leads Estudiantes to the Sudamericana..if he doesn't then we must see D'Alessandro ;)

[threervana]

Cuchu plays better in the formation of 442 parallel midfield like inter milan.

Yep~Both Veron and D'alessadro should come back ~~And hopefully Aimar~:D

[Arg10]

What I didn't understand was why Basile called up D'Alessandro for the WCQ yet he didn't even make the bench. I really can't wrap my head around it. He's been playing very well lately and I think he deserves a call. Considering his age, he'll be something like 29 in 2010 which isn't bad.

Gago will get better. He's still very young and playing regularly for Madrid every week. I know that alot of us are waiting on Banega(myself included), but I doubt we'll see him for a while. He has the talent, but his head isn't there. Just when he was starting to string a few consecutive matches together with Atletico, he gets himself red carded. Until he can calm down and begin to really play every week, we have Gago. Question is, where does Cambiasso come in all this? He's been playing amazing for Inter and his talent can't go to waste with the NT. He gives everything for the shirt, is beginning to be somewhat of a veteran in the locker room. As much as I like the Gago/Mascherano combination, we can't eliminate Cambiasso. We have alot of players at our disposal, so much so that I decided to make out a list(yes, I am that bored).

Riquelme, Di Maria, Gago, Mascherano, Lucho, Battaglia, Gutierrez, Maxi, D'Alessandro, Aimar, Banega, Veron, Buonanotte, Ledesma, Cambiasso

Out of who will make it in 2010(assuming injuries and stuff don't play a factor):
Riquelme, Di Maria, Gago, Mascherano, Maxi, Cambiasso, Aimar, Lucho/Gutierrez/D'Alessandro/Banega/Veron/Buonanotte

The last 6 that I put, in my opinion, have a real chance at 2010. Lucho, I think will somehow always be in the equation. Gutierrez has the speed, can attack and defend. D'Alessandro if he can keep playing the way he's playing right now, then I see no reason why he would be excluded(aside from injury), Banega I already touched on, Veron depends on Veron(his age and if he actually does keep playing until 2010) and Buonanotte. Buonanotte is the real wild card for me. If used correctly, as a substitute, he can play a key role in the team. Sadly though, he would get killed against tall teams(Germany, Holland, Serbia). So we would have to use him wisely.

[threervana]

What I didn't understand was why Basile called up D'Alessandro for the WCQ yet he didn't even make the bench. I really can't wrap my head around it. He's been playing very well lately and I think he deserves a call. Considering his age, he'll be something like 29 in 2010 which isn't bad.

Gago will get better. He's still very young and playing regularly for Madrid every week. I know that alot of us are waiting on Banega(myself included), but I doubt we'll see him for a while. He has the talent, but his head isn't there. Just when he was starting to string a few consecutive matches together with Atletico, he gets himself red carded. Until he can calm down and begin to really play every week, we have Gago. Question is, where does Cambiasso come in all this? He's been playing amazing for Inter and his talent can't go to waste with the NT. He gives everything for the shirt, is beginning to be somewhat of a veteran in the locker room. As much as I like the Gago/Mascherano combination, we can't eliminate Cambiasso. We have alot of players at our disposal, so much so that I decided to make out a list(yes, I am that bored).

Riquelme, Di Maria, Gago, Mascherano, Lucho, Battaglia, Gutierrez, Maxi, D'Alessandro, Aimar, Banega, Veron, Buonanotte, Ledesma, Cambiasso

Out of who will make it in 2010(assuming injuries and stuff don't play a factor):
Riquelme, Di Maria, Gago, Mascherano, Maxi, Cambiasso, Aimar, Lucho/Gutierrez/D'Alessandro/Banega/Veron/Buonanotte

The last 6 that I put, in my opinion, have a real chance at 2010. Lucho, I think will somehow always be in the equation. Gutierrez has the speed, can attack and defend. D'Alessandro if he can keep playing the way he's playing right now, then I see no reason why he would be excluded(aside from injury), Banega I already touched on, Veron depends on Veron(his age and if he actually does keep playing until 2010) and Buonanotte. Buonanotte is the real wild card for me. If used correctly, as a substitute, he can play a key role in the team. Sadly though, he would get killed against tall teams(Germany, Holland, Serbia). So we would have to use him wisely.

I'm afraid Aimar's place for 2010 is not that stable as he hasn't played for NT almost a year and a half since Copa America:o

Cambiasso was of no doubt to make it initially but one unexpected decision by Diego changed the situation.:eek:

We can not be quite sure that Di Maria is 100% in the list as he only played half a macth for NT, right?? Although we all know that Diego will keep an eye on him definitely.:p

So far we can only predict that in the midfield Riquelme, Mascherano, Gago and Maxi will make it in 2010~~~:cool:

[Arg10]

I'm afraid Aimar's place for 2010 is not that stable as he hasn't played for NT almost a year and a half since Copa America:o

Cambiasso was of no doubt to make it initially but one unexpected decision by Diego changed the situation.:eek:

We can not be quite sure that Di Maria is 100% in the list as he only played half a macth for NT, right?? Although we all know that Diego will keep an eye on him definitely.:p

So far we can only predict that in the midfield Riquelme, Mascherano, Gago and Maxi will make it in 2010~~~:cool:

Argentina to host the 2011 Copa America! It was just announced today.


Back to the main topic. You do have a point with Aimar, but hasn't it always been that way? He's always been proned to injury yet he somehow always makes it to the big tournaments. Hopefully thats the case, again.

Di Maria is bound to be a regular starter with the NT. Lets not forget that he was picked by Diego versus Scotland but he did get injured.

[threervana]

Argentina to host the 2011 Copa America! It was just announced today.


Back to the main topic. You do have a point with Aimar, but hasn't it always been that way? He's always been proned to injury yet he somehow always makes it to the big tournaments. Hopefully thats the case, again.

Di Maria is bound to be a regular starter with the NT. Lets not forget that he was picked by Diego versus Scotland but he did get injured.

True. Hope Aimar regain his best form soon and actually he is playing well now in Benfica.

Di Maria seems to be the only left-footed Left Midfielder we have now and I also believe that he would play an important role in NT in future.

[Aimar-21]

I believe that the problem of the Albiceleste is that there are plenty of players in some positions while very few in others.

For example there are many good forwards, the best in the world. Aguero-Messi-Tevez are world class. And there are other very good players behind them Lavezzi, Milito, Di Maria, Sand, Denis, Palacio, Bergessio etc. And of course former stars that can still be considered as potential candidates like Zarate and Cavenaghi. There are easily more than 10 good attackers.
Also there are plenty good defensive midfielders. Gago, Mascherano, Cambiasso, Banega, even Battaglia, the two Ledesmas etc
And also there are good attacking midfielders apart from Riquelme. Good enganches always exist in Argentina.

On the other hand, I believe there is a huge defensive problem. For me Heinze and Di Michelis are just not good enough. After Ayala there is not any good DC in my opinion. Also at the full backs. Zanetti is getting older by the day. Zabaleta is not anything good, maybe Ferrari could solve the problem ?
At the left side things could be better in the future with Monzon-Papa, but nothing is sure until now.
And I dont know about the GK. I know there a lot of fans of Carrizo, but I'm not so convinced yet, I want to see more of him. These past years there have been many young super-prospect keepers and most of them didnt make it. Names like Ustari-Costanzo for example.
Last but not least the left wing (right wing with Maxi is very good, and Lucho can play there too).

[threervana]

I'm not sure Lucho can play the right wing well now. He is not that Lucho in River any more and he has changed to a standard central midfielder.

[msi2]

I believe that the problem of the Albiceleste is that there are plenty of players in some positions while very few in others.

For example there are many good forwards, the best in the world. Aguero-Messi-Tevez are world class. And there are other very good players behind them Lavezzi, Milito, Di Maria, Sand, Denis, Palacio, Bergessio etc. And of course former stars that can still be considered as potential candidates like Zarate and Cavenaghi. There are easily more than 10 good attackers.
Also there are plenty good defensive midfielders. Gago, Mascherano, Cambiasso, Banega, even Battaglia, the two Ledesmas etc
And also there are good attacking midfielders apart from Riquelme. Good enganches always exist in Argentina.

On the other hand, I believe there is a huge defensive problem. For me Heinze and Di Michelis are just not good enough. After Ayala there is not any good DC in my opinion. Also at the full backs. Zanetti is getting older by the day. Zabaleta is not anything good, maybe Ferrari could solve the problem ?
At the left side things could be better in the future with Monzon-Papa, but nothing is sure until now.
And I dont know about the GK. I know there a lot of fans of Carrizo, but I'm not so convinced yet, I want to see more of him. These past years there have been many young super-prospect keepers and most of them didnt make it. Names like Ustari-Costanzo for example.
Last but not least the left wing (right wing with Maxi is very good, and Lucho can play there too).

IMO, you can write Sand, Denis, Palacio, Bergessio and co. off easily.
I mean, Sand is fine for Lanus and that's all.
Denis has been truly underwhelming with the albiceleste so...
Palacio and Bergessio are not NT material imo.
I would exchange easily 4 or 5 of these players to get a new Crespo, rather than a new dwarf or enano please... :rolleyes: (sorry when i see Buonanotte, i just can't get excited (and imo he's not that good))

Di Maria is more a winger of even out an outside midfielder (in a 4-3-1-2 formation). So he's not the same as the others cited.

About our defense, i sort of agree with you about Heinze but it seems Maradona will count on him. One thing to remember with Demichelis is a defensive midfielder of formation at first. Personally, i think he's far to be the worse. There's also Gonzalo Rodriguez, Nico Pareja, Garay, Fazio and maybe the return of Samuel.

Disagree with you totally with Zabaleta. He was fine at the OG and combined pretty well with Messi. On the top of that, he was much more offensive i thought he would be. About Ferrari, i think imo he's not really NT material. But here's my opinion and i know a lot will disagree with me. To be honest, dont look at River to find any NT material. None of the presently River Plate players are remotely close having the NT level. :D

About goalkeepers, Carizzo is fine. :confused:
I mean, do you forget we come off from El Pato? :D


For me, the real miss is the typical 9. A New Crespo please, anyday. Enough of the 1.60m dwarfs!

[west501]

we need a balance between stars and squad players
I was getting at that before with Gago, because he tries (and fails often) to assert himself as equal or even over Masche, when what we need is a complementary player (Cambiasso)
ultimately what matters most is who plays best with him andthe same goes for other positions as well
it's true we don't have a star left back or left midfielder
but we have fantastic squad players in Di María or even Maxi who could play at the left
there is no backup for Zanetti, one of the great right backs of all time, but Zabaleta is suitable and a phenomenal squad player
I think it's quite clear at this point that we will be playing with 1 striker, so good luck to him
I disagree about the defence
all of the players msi mentions are of high quality
Micho is no Ayala but he is able and remember G.Milito is coming back by March..I prefer him over Heinze, but Heinze is pure balls and I think he will do well in central D
Carrizo is clearly better than Pato from a technical standpoint, but even moreso from a confidence standpoint
he was the motm 80% of the time last season, we let him go for cheap and now we're in last place :eek:
the best thing about Carrizo is that his high confidence is never shaken by a weak goal and this translates to the defence
also with Bilardo around, I wouldn't worry about the defence..remember Bilardo, as poor a trainer as he was, essentially built an unbeatable Argentina
anyhow I am off to watch the sudamericana final :D

[threervana]

For me, the real miss is the typical 9. A New Crespo please, anyday. Enough of the 1.60m dwarfs!

Yep. We are so eager to find a typical 9 as Crespo but Diego Milito, Cavenaghi or even Denis is still far away from him.

[Arg10]

All of this discussion about #9's made me Youtube Crespo and Batigol.

v/VIem1nQ8Qek
Crespo - Must see:eek: *Note, this is Crespo only in Italy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIem1nQ8Qek

v/7YniB5czMYI
Batigol and Crespo - Double :eek::eek:

THIS is what Argentina has been missing infront of goal. No matter how hard we search, I'm sorry but Cavenaghi, Lopez, Denis, Higuain and Milito are not and never will be Crespo/Batigol.

[Aimar-21]

I'm not at all sure about the defenders and in the past we have seen it many times. I'm not sure about Garay, but Fazio, Pareja and other players mentioned here are very average until now.
Balls are not enough for someone to be a defender.
Yes a number 9 is missing, but even with the good 9s, the team did not achieve much. Take for example the 2002 World Cup which was a complete disaster.

[Arg10]

So I just finished watching the Copa Sudamericana 2nd leg and I have to say that D'Alessandro has still got it. I've watched the Semi-Finals(both legs) and the final(both legs) and I have to say that I would love to have D'Alessandro on the team. He's seemed to have re-found the form that he lost in Europe. He can play either on the left or right side, he can be Maxi's substitute(or starter seeing as how Maxi is proned to injury). He's still fairly young(27).

I know that guest501 watched the final of the Sudamericana and was wondering if he(or anyone else) would agree with me?

[west501]

So I just finished watching the Copa Sudamericana 2nd leg and I have to say that D'Alessandro has still got it. I've watched the Semi-Finals(both legs) and the final(both legs) and I have to say that I would love to have D'Alessandro on the team. He's seemed to have re-found the form that he lost in Europe. He can play either on the left or right side, he can be Maxi's substitute(or starter seeing as how Maxi is proned to injury). He's still fairly young(27).

I know that guest501 watched the final of the Sudamericana and was wondering if he(or anyone else) would agree with me?

I agree, D'Alessandro provided a masterclass, outshining the old master Verón in a string of performances that was truly a joy to watch
I'd give him another chance on the seleccionado, but imo he doesn't replace Maxi, but rather Riquelme (with whom he could never share a pitch..remember what happened with Aimar...)
his skill is not in question, its his character that is a liability
he says he'll never change his quarrelsome nature on/off the pitch and some trainers and teammates may not like that while others might
I guess it's up to Diego :(:rolleyes:

[Arg10]

I agree, D'Alessandro provided a masterclass, outshining the old master Verón in a string of performances that was truly a joy to watch
I'd give him another chance on the seleccionado, but imo he doesn't replace Maxi, but rather Riquelme (with whom he could never share a pitch..remember what happened with Aimar...)
his skill is not in question, its his character that is a liability
he says he'll never change his quarrelsome nature on/off the pitch and some trainers and teammates may not like that while others might
I guess it's up to Diego :(:rolleyes:

Thats usually what happens with all of our engaches. Ortega, Riquelme, D'Alessandro, Veron. They have(had) the skills to be the best players in the World, but their "off the field" troubles cost them.

Speaking of Riquelme and Veron...

Maradona: Riquelme Or Veron To 'Coach' Argentina
Diego Maradona, the new coach of the Argentine national team, affirmed that either Juan Roman Riquelme or Juan Sebastian Veron will be given the responsibility to marshal his team on the field of play...

Diego Armando Maradona, the coach of the Argentine national team, affirmed that either Juan Roman Riquelme or Juan Sebastian Veron will be charged with the responsibility of being his on-field representative.

"Out of Riquelme and Veron, one of the two has to be a starter, to steer the team forward and give orders, to be the coach inside of the field," Maradona told Radio La Red.

Maradona, who asked Riquelme to take a vacation to rest ahead of a crucial year, praised Veron, declaring that the Estudiantes de La Plata captain was one of "the best players in the world".

"We will have to find him a place, play with more midfielders or something. That's why we are here, to find places for these players who are guaranteed to give rivals lots of difficulty. I have a big problem here," he joked.

'El Pibe de Oro', who debuted as the coach of Los Albicelestes with a 1-0 victory over Scotland in Glasgow last month, wants his midfield to have the balance provided by Javier Mascherano and Fernando Gago.

"As for now, I want the balance given by Mascherano and Gago. I'm not thinking about anything else, unless there are problems and I have to change something. With them I can assemble a strong team both in an offensive and defensive aspect," stated the 48-year-old.

Argentina's first match of 2009 will be a friendly match against France in February. Maradona will use the match to prepare his squad for the restart of the 2010 World Cup qualifiers the following month.
http://www.goal.com/en/news/585/argentina/2008/12/11/1006752/maradona-riquelme-or-veron-to-coach-argentina


Veron's gonna be like 86 years old at the next World Cup. Riquelme needs to find form and fast.

[threervana]

Oh~~Sounds no chance for D'alessadro~or Lucho or Aimar and many others...

[west501]

Thats usually what happens with all of our engaches. Ortega, Riquelme, D'Alessandro, Veron. They have(had) the skills to be the best players in the World, but their "off the field" troubles cost them.

Speaking of Riquelme and Veron...

Veron's gonna be like 86 years old at the next World Cup. Riquelme needs to find form and fast.

jajaja you might be right
but anyway, even amongst those D'Alessandro's head sticks out
they call him the big headed one for a reason :p

I actually haven't seen that interview (in Spanish) and not that I really listen to anything Diego has to say (out of context or otherwise), but it seems like he leaves the door open for Verón to play
I actually think a mature Verón has a better chance to share the field than Román or D'Alessandro
I thought he did well the last few times I saw him
it's true he will be old, but he could be a squad player

edit: that is one thing Bilardo did very well in 86 was to take squad players of the calibre of a Verón now even if they had little chance to break into the first team..you saw players like Borghi, Bochini, Tapia, Trobbiani who would never take Maradona's place but deserved to go as representatives of a golden generation of players
Pekerman did a similar job in 2006, though arguably got his substitutions wrong

[Arg10]

jajaja you might be right
but anyway, even amongst those D'Alessandro's head sticks out
they call him the big headed one for a reason :p

I actually haven't seen that interview (in Spanish) and not that I really listen to anything Diego has to say (out of context or otherwise), but it seems like he leaves the door open for Verón to play
I actually think a mature Verón has a better chance to share the field than Román or D'Alessandro
I thought he did well the last few times I saw him
it's true he will be old, but he could be a squad player

edit: that is one thing Bilardo did very well in 86 was to take squad players of the calibre of a Verón now even if they had little chance to break into the first team..you saw players like Borghi, Bochini, Tapia, Trobbiani who would never take Maradona's place but deserved to go as representatives of a golden generation of players
Pekerman did a similar job in 2006, though arguably got his substitutions wrong

Haha, biggest understatement of the year. You would think that he would of learnt from the England match in 2005 never to take Riquelme off again... or at the very least replace him with Aimar. Speaking of which, we've always had "good" combinations never used by our coaches. Bielsa refused to play Batistuta and Crespo together in 2002 and Pekerman/Basile refused to play Aimar and Riquelme together. At the very least if you take Riquelme out atleast put in Aimar and thats something I still don't understand from the Quarter Final match against Germany.

In any case, here's Diego's list for the match on Tuesday.

Goalkeepers: Agustín ORION (San Lorenzo), Mariano ANDUJAR (Estudiantes de La Plata).

Defenders: Juan FORLIN (Boca Juniors), Matías CARUZZO (Argentinos Juniors), Christian VILLAGRA (River Plate), Marcos ANGELERI (Estudiantes de La Plata) and Emiliano PAPA (Vélez Sarsfield).

Midfielders: Franco ZUCULINI, Maximiliano MORALEZ (Racing Club), Néstor ORTIGOZA (Argentinos Juniors), Jesús DÁTOLO (Boca Jrs.), Daniel MONTENEGRO (Independiente) and Sebastián BLANCO (Lanús).

Forwards: Gonzalo BERGESSIO (San Lorenzo).

They're all local league players and the match is against Tristán Suárez.

Anyone we should be looking at in particular? The only players I know are Moralez and Orion.

[west501]

In any case, here's Diego's list for the match on Tuesday.

Goalkeepers: Agustín ORION (San Lorenzo), Mariano ANDUJAR (Estudiantes de La Plata).

Defenders: Juan FORLIN (Boca Juniors), Matías CARUZZO (Argentinos Juniors), Christian VILLAGRA (River Plate), Marcos ANGELERI (Estudiantes de La Plata) and Emiliano PAPA (Vélez Sarsfield).

Midfielders: Franco ZUCULINI, Maximiliano MORALEZ (Racing Club), Néstor ORTIGOZA (Argentinos Juniors), Jesús DÁTOLO (Boca Jrs.), Daniel MONTENEGRO (Independiente) and Sebastián BLANCO (Lanús).

Forwards: Gonzalo BERGESSIO (San Lorenzo).

They're all local league players and the match is against Tristán Suárez.

Anyone we should be looking at in particular? The only players I know are Moralez and Orion.

Dátolo may be what we need for the left side of the midfield
he is a natural outside attacking midfielder, very skilful, a squad player, can play with Riquelme
he's been up and down the last few years but his current form* deserves the callup for sure
Andujar is one of the best keepers we've produced in recent years..actually with Orion and Assman (and of course, Carrizo, Romero, Ustari in the exterior) we have to be really confused about why we used Pato for so long
the top Argentine keepers right now: Carrizo and Andujar

*he was massive today :( I wish he hadn't set up those two goals :rolleyes:

[Arg10]

Well 2009 is almost here and I think we have ALOT to look forward to, not only in terms of opponents but in everything. Our first "tough" opponent(taking nothing away from Scotland) under Diego is France in February and in March we have 2 World Cup Qualifier matches. By February Diego should have an idea of who he wants in his team and how to play them. Personally, I'm dying to see D'Alessandro back on the team. He could be the spark in midfield that we've been missing for a while. However Diego did say that he wants either Veron or Riquelme back with Argentina, so I'm not sure if I'll get to see D'Alessandro back(atleast anytime soon). So Diego has to figure that out. He also needs to try and fix our backline of Demichelis, Zanetti, Heinze and whoever else he wants to throw in there. And we can't forget about our forwards. Who'll start up front and who'll be relegated to the bench.

Looking back at 2008... it could of been worse. I think the only thing that saved this year from being a total disaster was the Olympics. Well that and Basile quiting. So yeah, could of been worse.

Whats everyone looking forward to in 2009?

[threervana]

Promising players on the positions we lack would catch my attention definitely. I very look forward to Angeleri's debut for NT at first, just to see whether he could succeed Zanetti. As for the left side, I also like to see how Papa will perform. These 2 are the only new blood Diego brings in so far. And would also keep an eye on other alternatives like Monzon, Zabaleta, Ansaldi, Insua,etc.

And then, as everyone says, expect a traditional big #9 who could score for NT. As Cavenaghi, Milito, Lisandro and Denis all made us a bit disappointed in 2008, really hope one of them would stand up in 2009, or a new guy like Di Santo??? (BTW, Wish him a shining U20 journey), or Higuain (Although is not quite traditional)???

Finally, of course, wanna see how Diego will show his magic as the coach!!

P.S I'm dying to see Aimar back~~:)

[west501]

Whats everyone looking forward to in 2009?

I look forward to 5/9/2009 when we get Brazil at home ;)

I still see Diego's appointment as the worst thing of 2008 so it goes without saying that He is going to have to prove it to me in 2009
so I look forward to this year with a nervous anticipation and a tortured heart as one of Diego's biggest fans and biggest detractors
maybe the thing I anticipate the most is Messi's ascension to the top of the international stage :cool:
the thing I dread is the infighting and scandals that will certainly take centre stage :eek:

[Arg10]

Promising players on the positions we lack would catch my attention definitely. I very look forward to Angeleri's debut for NT at first, just to see whether he could succeed Zanetti. As for the left side, I also like to see how Papa will perform. These 2 are the only new blood Diego brings in so far. And would also keep an eye on other alternatives like Monzon, Zabaleta, Ansaldi, Insua,etc.

I've been waiting to see Angeleri with the National Team as well. Not sure if he would be able to succeed Zanetti, but if he can learn from Zanetti and become even half as good as el Pupi I'll be more than happy. I still think we should bring 2 right backs for the World Cup. When Burdisso got injured versus the Netherlands it was a huge blow. We can't afford to have something like that happen again. Monzon with Real Betis has been great this season and I would love to see him at left back. Insua is finally starting to get minutes with Liverpool and is playing well, so he might be there in 2010.

And then, as everyone says, expect a traditional big #9 who could score for NT. As Cavenaghi, Milito, Lisandro and Denis all made us a bit disappointed in 2008, really hope one of them would stand up in 2009, or a new guy like Di Santo??? (BTW, Wish him a shining U20 journey), or Higuain (Although is not quite traditional)???

Finally, of course, wanna see how Diego will show his magic as the coach!!

P.S I'm dying to see Aimar back~~:)

We REALLY need a #9. I'm sorry but I don't want to keep playing with 2 or 3 midgets up front. Milito is the type of player(for me) who needs confidence from his coach and thats something that Basile never had in some of his players. When Crespo got injured versus Colombia in the Copa America, Milito came on as a sub and finished the match. What happens? He's benched next match. Yet look at him in Italy. Lisandro I doubt will ever get a real chance. Denis isn't even National Team material for me. Higuain isn't a traditional #9 and needs to work on his finishing. Di Santo is still way too young which leaves us Cavenaghi. The guy is a machine. USE HIM!

Oh and I wouldn't mind seeing Aimar back either:p


I still see Diego's appointment as the worst thing of 2008 so it goes without saying that He is going to have to prove it to me in 2009
so I look forward to this year with a nervous anticipation and a tortured heart as one of Diego's biggest fans and biggest detractors
maybe the thing I anticipate the most is Messi's ascension to the top of the international stage
the thing I dread is the infighting and scandals that will certainly take centre stage

No doubt 2009 is going to be a rocky year. The Maradona era will be in full swing, expect scandals, expect name calling. But it comes with the territory.

EDIT: http://www.goal.com/en/news/0/general/0001/01/01/1031695/title-not-present

Look for Zarate to make his debut and Cambiasso to come back(according to Diego).

[threervana]

Milito is the type of player(for me) who needs confidence from his coach and thats something that Basile never had in some of his players. When Crespo got injured versus Colombia in the Copa America, Milito came on as a sub and finished the match. What happens? He's benched next match. Yet look at him in Italy. Lisandro I doubt will ever get a real chance. Denis isn't even National Team material for me. Higuain isn't a traditional #9 and needs to work on his finishing. Di Santo is still way too young which leaves us Cavenaghi. The guy is a machine. USE HIM!

Oh and I wouldn't mind seeing Aimar back either:p



As far as I could remember, Basile did give Milito some chances: The Copa America Game against Peru in quarter final, the friendly against Norway and his last WCQ match against Chile. He did almost nothing and missed a lot scoring chances. He has to be confident in NT in order to gain the confidence from the coach.

I am also a let-Cavanaghi-be-our-Next-#9 supporter and really wish him could succeed Crespo. But he is not doing quite well nowadays in France. So... Leave us no choice actually. We will see what will happen to him next year.

Messi, Aguero, Tevez, Lavezzi, Palacio and now Zarate~~we are way too luxurious in supporting striker position~~:p

Cambiasso surely deserves a re-call. But it seems he will sit on the bench as Diego trusts Mascherano and Gago more.

[Aimar-21]

"Ismael Blanco es Argentino"

http://www.lanacion.com.ar/nota.asp?nota_id=1084964&high=Ismael

[msi2]

As far as I could remember, Basile did give Milito some chances: The Copa America Game against Peru in quarter final, the friendly against Norway and his last WCQ match against Chile. He did almost nothing and missed a lot scoring chances. He has to be confident in NT in order to gain the confidence from the coach.

I am also a let-Cavanaghi-be-our-Next-#9 supporter and really wish him could succeed Crespo. But he is not doing quite well nowadays in France. So... Leave us no choice actually. We will see what will happen to him next year.

Messi, Aguero, Tevez, Lavezzi, Palacio and now Zarate~~we are way too luxurious in supporting striker position~~:p

Cambiasso surely deserves a re-call. But it seems he will sit on the bench as Diego trusts Mascherano and Gago more.


What do you mean by he's not doing quite well in France? :confused:
He's the second top-scorer of the league with 11 goals for 18 or 19 games and unlike Denis (and to a certain extent Higuain) he's scoring regularly, not a time a hat-trick and then nothing for 5-6 games.
Moreover, he's only 25y old.

[threervana]

What do you mean by he's not doing quite well in France? :confused:
He's the second top-scorer of the league with 11 goals for 18 or 19 games and unlike Denis (and to a certain extent Higuain) he's scoring regularly, not a time a hat-trick and then nothing for 5-6 games.
Moreover, he's only 25y old.

He is obviously doing well in goals. But I hear the rumor saying he doesn't have enough play time in Bordeux and wants a transfer, right!!??!...
And I didn't actually see him playing in Champions League....which is not good.

God damn his stupid Coach!

[west501]

I see right now as similar to Bilardo's time in that we have no clear choice for a targetman
the hiring of Basile and now of Diego shows a disregard for team-building that I don't understand
Milito, Lisandro, Cavenaghi, Higuaín, etc could all do perfectly well, if not superbly, with the midfield and support strikers we have but we can't just put these guys in for 20 minutes and expect them to win the spot
we need a trainer with the balls to just give the 9 to someone and play him every match, allowing him to grow into the indispensable role player we need
I would obviously give it to Cavenaghi, but I think you pair any of those guys with the likes of a Messi, Agüero, Zárate, etc and they'll do the job
ultimately, Bilardo did well in 86 to put Valdano and fell asleep in 90 by leaving the position vacant
what will Diego do?

this just in: Messi grows balls and breaks AFA's idiotic deal with Barça that precluded him from playing friendlies (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/12/29/seleccion/01830605.html) :cool::cool::cool:
I'm sure this won't cause any problems :eek:

[Arg10]

I see right now as similar to Bilardo's time in that we have no clear choice for a targetman
the hiring of Basile and now of Diego shows a disregard for team-building that I don't understand
Milito, Lisandro, Cavenaghi, Higuaín, etc could all do perfectly well, if not superbly, with the midfield and support strikers we have but we can't just put these guys in for 20 minutes and expect them to win the spot
we need a trainer with the balls to just give the 9 to someone and play him every match, allowing him to grow into the indispensable role player we need
I would obviously give it to Cavenaghi, but I think you pair any of those guys with the likes of a Messi, Agüero, Zárate, etc and they'll do the job
ultimately, Bilardo did well in 86 to put Valdano and fell asleep in 90 by leaving the position vacant
what will Diego do?

this just in: Messi grows balls and breaks AFA's idiotic deal with Barça that precluded him from playing friendlies (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2008/12/29/seleccion/01830605.html) :cool::cool::cool:
I'm sure this won't cause any problems :eek:

Nice to see Messi standing up for himself. I doubt it'll be that big of a deal since he said that he talked to Guardiola about it and that he understands. As long as Laporta says nothing, this shouldn't be a problem.

[west501]

Juan Sebastian Veron named the South American Footballer of the Year 2008 (http://www.ovaciondigital.com.uy/081231/futinter-390430/futbolinternacional/america-corono-a-sebastian-veron)
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/columns/molinaro/gfx/veron-juan-392.jpg

Giving him this trophy in a year without trophies and with multiple injuries is a tribute to just how brilliant he was to watch.

This was recently voted the goal of the season in the Apertura:
v/IcQBrFIJma8
You can 'watch in high quality (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcQBrFIJma8)' at the bottom right of the actual link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcQBrFIJma8)..it's very worth it (though it seems to ruin the sound).

[Arg10]

Qué golazo is all I have to say. If only he was that good with the National Team... 2002 might have ended differently:( Congrats to him though.

Oh and we're facing Spain in November 2009...

http://www.goal.com/en/news/585/argentina/2008/12/30/1033982/spain-to-celebrate-centenary-year-against-argentina

[threervana]

Revenge~~:)

[Arg10]

Has anyone else heard about Buonanotte going to play in Qatar? It's career suicide. Zarate was no where when he played there and Buonanotte is likely to follow in his footsteps. Go to Italy, go to Spain, go to Europe and play. Or stay in Argentina and developpe some more.

[west501]

Has anyone else heard about Buonanotte going to play in Qatar? It's career suicide. Zarate was no where when he played there and Buonanotte is likely to follow in his footsteps. Go to Italy, go to Spain, go to Europe and play. Or stay in Argentina and developpe some more.

it's a strong rumour..so far he is not speaking of it and the 'investment company'* that owns his transfer isn't either but apparently the offer exists
el Enano suffered a dreadful semestre but I would like him to stay and regain form
speaking of 'investment companies'* look at what is happening with Carlitos
I would actually like him to move from England, as his play has worsened since he went there, but it's still a terrible situation for the player to be going through

*this exploitive practise must be stopped by FIFA

[msi2]

Has anyone else heard about Buonanotte going to play in Qatar? It's career suicide. Zarate was no where when he played there and Buonanotte is likely to follow in his footsteps.

Actually, Zarate was very lucky to bounce back like he did. He was loaned out to Birmingham and then to Lazio but the thing to keep in mind is the financial crisis wasnt there at that time. The clubs were still able to fork for him. Not sure if Buonanotte would benefit the same luck.

Unfortunately, River is in desperate need of fresh cash and Gorosito is not against his sale. From what i have read, we cant even pay $50.000US promised for Galmarini to Tigre.... (actually it's $500.000US in ten times) Just shows how poorly managed argentine football is..... River is that case being a shining example of that, unfortunately.


speaking of 'investment companies'* look at what is happening with Carlitos
I would actually like him to move from England, as his play has worsened since he went there, but it's still a terrible situation for the player to be going through

*this exploitive practise must be stopped by FIFA

Ah! I thought i was the only one thinking this, but indeed his play got quite a bit downgraded to say the least.

[Arg10]

It looks like some talk has died down concerning Buonanotte leaving to Qatar... but talks of him going to Italy are alive from what I've read.

Speaking of reading, I was reading this article about Ayala possibly going back to Italy and playing with Lazio... and then I saw this quote.

Claudio Anellucci, agent of Real Zaragoza defender Roberto Fabian Ayala, left a door open on the possibility of his client joining Lazio, as has been rumoured in the Italian media over the past few days.

So far Anellucci has just proposed his idea to the Biancocelesti, but in the coming days there might be further discussions with the club and a solution could, perhaps, be found.

"There is nothing concrete for the time being," declared the player's agent to Teleradiostereo. "Ayala to Lazio is just an idea so far which I and my entourage proposed to the president [Claudio Lotito].

"The player is physically fine, with a great personality and has done well wherever he has been. Maradona is also trying to bring him back to the national team.

"Right now he is in difficulty because he is trying to leave Zaragoza as they, incredibly, find themselves in the second division, despite the presence of great players.

"Now we shall try to arrange a meeting with president Lotito to continue discussing this idea, considering that they've been saying that Lazio's defence needs personality, security and experience."

The 35-year-old defender has been at Real Zaragoza since 2007, but he also has two other experiences in Italy, with Napoli between 1995 and 1998 and Milan between 1998 and 2000.

http://www.goal.com/en/news/698/lazio/2009/01/08/1051188/ayala-to-lazio-is-possible-agent


I wouldn't be surprised if what his agent said was true. I think Diego knows that aside from Demichelis, we don't have a true center back. And for the life of me why Gonzalez hasn't gotten called up I don't know. He's clealry up there in age, but he's someone that I've personally always looked up to as a player. Both on and off the pitch. So what's everyones take on this? Should he come back? Would he come back?

[msi2]

Ayala... argh!
Look, i like a lot Ayala, but we have to do a generational change, not going backward!

[threervana]

It's a bit impossible for him to come back...

He is still the best, no doubt about that. But I would take risk and give chance to Garay or Gonzalo now instead of taking risk 1 year and a half later.

[west501]

I don't think it's a good idea to call back el Ratón

[msi2]

Yeah, confirmed:
http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/01/10/seleccion/01836982.html

[threervana]

Oh~They realy would talk about it~~~

Unbelivable~!!!

[robin9]

Lately there are a lot of rumours here in greece talking about Palacio joining Panathinaikos for ~12mil. It seems pretty unlikely to me but what do you guys think of it ?

[threervana]

I just heard that Napoli wants Palacio if they sell Lavezzi~~

I don't think he would like to go to Greece and he actullay don't wanna leave Boca. Joining Panathinaikos would make him disappear from our sight, so I hope not~~

But boca might accept the price. We will see.

[Arg10]

Lately there are a lot of rumours here in greece talking about Palacio joining Panathinaikos for ~12mil. It seems pretty unlikely to me but what do you guys think of it ?

I wouldn't count on it. There's been rumours the past few years linking Palacio to Barcelona, Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid, Inter Milan and nothing came out of it. Palacio is gonna stay in Argentina for the rest of his life, which I think is a shame because I'd really like to see what he could do in Europe. He would gain some experience that's for damn sure. It's either he's scared of going to Europe and failing or he knows he'll get home sick... or both.

As for the Ayala story, I look up to him(and Zanetti of course) but would I like to see Ayala back in the team? I don't know, I haven't watched him in Zaragoza this year to see how he's doing.

[threervana]

I wouldn't count on it. There's been rumours the past few years linking Palacio to Barcelona, Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid, Inter Milan and nothing came out of it. Palacio is gonna stay in Argentina for the rest of his life, which I think is a shame because I'd really like to see what he could do in Europe. He would gain some experience that's for damn sure. It's either he's scared of going to Europe and failing or he knows he'll get home sick... or both.

As for the Ayala story, I look up to him(and Zanetti of course) but would I like to see Ayala back in the team? I don't know, I haven't watched him in Zaragoza this year to see how he's doing.

No~~u don't understand man~

Palacio just wants to follow the path of his idol -- Guillermo Barros Schelotto:D

[Arg10]

It looks like we'll see Diego Milito against France according to Diego(well you have to read between the lines).

“In Italy there are many Argentinean players that I follow, such as [Mauro] Zarate and [Diego] Milito, Maradona stated in the interview.

“They have proven their quality this season, and so if they can continue their good form, they will be rewarded in the near future,” he added.

Maradona also had kind words of praise for another Lazio player, Cristian Ledesma, who has rejected calls from Argentina in the past, as he wishes to pursue his international career with Italy.

“Even Ledesma should expect a call from me shortly, as he is also playing really well.

“From there, the decision is his, as to whether or not he accepts,” the Argentinean legend concluded.
http://www.goal.com/en/news/585/argentina/2009/01/13/1057798/maradona-arrives-in-milan-praises-his-italian-based-players

As of now this is my prediction for the squad against France.

Carrizo, Romero

Zanetti, Zabaleta, Demichelis, Heinze, Papa, Angelieri

Mascherano, Gago, Maxi, Di Maria, Cambiasso, Riquelme/Veron

Zarate, Messi, Aguero, Milito, Tevez, Lavezzi, Higuain

Not sure how many players he's allowed to bring but from what I've read in the past few weeks, thats my guess. Riquelme/Veron, well Diego has said that he wants one of them on the team. The only possible exclusion might be Higuain. But who knows.

[west501]

this match against France is going to be big but it's a good while before he names the squad!
I would love to see the top scorer in France in the mix ;):(

I must say that Diego showing his face so prominently in Europe's big league matches pleases me....but not enough to change my sig or spite him in my favourite player(s) box :mad:

I would like to see
Agüero-Cavenaghi-Messi
Cambiasso-Román-Masche(c)
Insua*-Samuel-Demichelis-Zanetti
JP 'Gardel' Carrizo

*or Monzón because Insúa is away captaining the sub-20..I hope Emiliano gets a chance with the senior side in 2009 as he's looked good for Pool

[threervana]

When did Cristian Ledesma reject calls from Argentina in the past?????!!!!:?
I don't trust Goal.com:P

Cavegol Supporter +1 here. But maybe we should give Diego Milito another chance~

[west501]

man, just when I compliment Diego....he tells Kun to transfer to Inter :o
it's as if he reads the forum and tries to upset me on purpose :mad:

[robin9]

Higuain has never been called for Argentina right ?
Has Maradona said anything about him ?

[threervana]

Higuain has never been called for Argentina right ?
Has Maradona said anything about him ?

He was called by U20 two years ago but he turned it down because of personal reason, which might irritate Diego Maradona.

Later he was called by U23 twice and actually played that two friendlies scoring two goals in total. But he was out of the final list for the Olympics. I don't know the real reason for that. Some said Real Madrid prevented him from joining the team for the pre-season. Some said AFA ticked him out as a result of his previous refusal.

man, just when I compliment Diego....he tells Kun to transfer to Inter :o
it's as if he reads the forum and tries to upset me on purpose :mad:

Isn't it better for him to transfet to Inter?:D

[west501]

Isn't it better for him to transfet to Inter?:D

I'm not so sure, now Agüero is on a great side where he is important
I don't like Mourinho and Inter has so many options so I think he should certainly stay
besides no one likes a meddler :mad:

how about this golaço by our Angel dedicated to D10S
v/AtxgYCYRayw
:eek::eek::eek:
looks like we might see Di María against France
you can watch in high quality if you follow the link
they need to make direct links for high quality

[deviant]

Aguero playing at Atletico means he is guaranteed a starting place where as Mourinho at Inter loves shuffling his cards way too much Aguero's development would suffer.

mark my words Higuain will be Argentina's #9 in 2010

[west501]

interview with Cavenaghi in olé (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/01/16/futbolinternacional/01840520.html)
he claims he never stated he wanted to leave Bordeaux, that the President of the club values him at 40 million Euros, Blanc didn't play him in the CL because he wanted to play with one target man and it needed to be a taller second striker type, and that of course he wants to be called up by Diego (from whom he has heard nothing :eek:)

[msi2]

interview with Cavenaghi in olé (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/01/16/futbolinternacional/01840520.html)
he claims he never stated he wanted to leave Bordeaux, that the President of the club values him at 40 million Euros, Blanc didn't play him in the CL because he wanted to play with one target man and it needed to a taller second striker type, and that of course he wants to be called up by Diego (from whom he has heard nothing :eek:)

Ugh...
Looks like he will have to go another league to get noticed. Everything but the EPL plz. :o

[Arg10]

interview with Cavenaghi in olé (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/01/16/futbolinternacional/01840520.html)
he claims he never stated he wanted to leave Bordeaux, that the President of the club values him at 40 million Euros, Blanc didn't play him in the CL because he wanted to play with one target man and it needed to be a taller second striker type, and that of course he wants to be called up by Diego (from whom he has heard nothing :eek:)

It clearly looks like if Cavenaghi wants a place on the team, he has to get out of France. That simple. And I don't understand why he doesn't want to move. I'm sure if he went to a club like Villarreal, Werder Bremen or a team that isn't filled with superstars, he would get a spot in the Starting XI, play in a better team, better league and have a chance to go far in the Champions League or atleast UEFA Cup. But in the end, it's up to him.

Speaking of National Team, D'Alessandro...

D'Alessandro: I Dream Of The World Cup

Internacional playmaker, Andres D'Alessandro, admitted that it would be a dream come true to participate with Argentina in the 2010 World Cup in South Africa...

Argentine midfielder Andres D'Alessandro, who plays for Internacional of Porto Alegre, admitted that he "dreams of playing in the next World Cup," but he understands that in order to reach his objective, he has to be in his best form with his Brazilian club at all moments.

"If one plays well in the local tournament, and in the other competitions, the opportunities will be there. I dream about this, to play in the World Cup with the national team," stated D'Alessandro, to Gazeta Esportiva on Friday.

The former River Plate, San Lorenzo, Wolfsburg, Portsmouth, and Real Zaragoza player was called up by former national team coach Alfio Basile, as soon as he joined Inter last year, but he wasn't given an opportunity to play.

D'Alessandro knows that he has to concentrate on playing well in Brazil, and doing so will possibly present him with greater possibilities with Argentina: "I want to be a protagonist at Inter. But the important thing will be to think about the group, more than personal goals."
The exciting playmaker played a key role as Internacional lifted the Copa Sudamericana for the first time last year.

http://www.goal.com/en/news/585/argentina/2009/01/16/1064013/dalessandro-i-dream-of-the-world-cup


Having D'Alessandro, Messi and Maxi in attack would be something else. Of course that would mean that Riquelme would be on the bench.

[threervana]

D'Alessandro + Messi ?? That would be interesting. They actually cooperated in one friendly as far as I could remember.

And I'm sure the one Messi really wants to pair would be his idol -- Aimar. They created some magics in the limited time they were both on the field for NT.

[deviant]

eh I really don't see D'Alessandro adding anything to the national team Copa America 04 was the last time he was decent I would be more in favor of Lucho Gonzalez

[Arg10]

D'Alessandro + Messi ?? That would be interesting. They actually cooperated in one friendly as far as I could remember.

And I'm sure the one Messi really wants to pair would be his idol -- Aimar. They created some magics in the limited time they were both on the field for NT.

I remember against Mexico in 2006, they were amazing together. They just clicked.

eh I really don't see D'Alessandro adding anything to the national team Copa America 04 was the last time he was decent I would be more in favor of Lucho Gonzalez

I wouldn't ming seeing Lucho back in the team. He did very bad under Basile(well pretty much everyone did). He did well under Pekerman and he's doing well with Porto. Lucho to me, seems like a confidence player. He needs the coach to have confidence in him to be able to play well. And Basile had confidence in no one.

D'Alessandro is more dynamic for me. We need someone with speed who's able to link up with Messi(Aimar has decent speed) and passing ability. Riquelme has the passing ability but is slower than a turtle.

As for your earlier post about Higuain being our #9 in 2010, you might be right. But he's not a usual #9. He has the height, but not the finishing. He has about a year and a half to work on his finishing. Maybe we've been spoiled by having deadly #9's like Batistuta, Crespo and Kempes in the past, so when we compare Higuain to them he seems horrible. He has a good shot from range, but misses sitters.

We really need to start looking at some combinations up front. Messi/Tevez started off promising(they did well in the World Cup together), but its been downhill ever since. Aguero/Higuain/Messi might be a freaking amazing trio, with Aguero playing behind Higuain. But for me, Zarate/Cavenaghi/Messi would be out of this world. Zarate can play on the wings(something Aguero and Higuain cannot do), Cavenaghi is the leading goal scorer in France if I'm not mistaken and of course the wonderkid. But of course for this to happen we need Cavenaghi to get the hell out of France.

Quick question, is it just me or does Aguero seem injury prone/gets easily tired? He looked bad in the Olympics and has missed several matches this season due to fatigue.

[msi2]

...or maybe just a little bit overated? :D

Simple question, but i have to say his performances so far under the NT shirt have been disappointing to say the least.
Lately he has been quite poor with Atletico.
But you have to factor in that the OG do no favor to player's form.
I'm not really surprised to see him injured after having began his season that early.
He was poor during the OG, out of shape (and probably in disavantage in Batista's system) and lacked the preseason preparation with Atletico so....

EDIT:

Cavenaghi is the only true decent 9 we have. Milito is a short term solution (32y old in 2010) and nothing tell us he will be good with the NT. Denis is not simply NT material. Then in the local league, we have Jose Sand...
About Cavenaghi, watch out the goal he scored against PSG last Sunday. Typical from a striker.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVHKGZZm-eQ&feature=related

Watch out how Higuain is playing with Real Madrid. He plays deeper in the field, moves much more around and again you have to watch his assist for Raul last Sunday also.

[west501]

Cavenaghi is the only true decent 9 we have.

this is absolutely true
he should have been the first choice after 2006 if he hadn't made such a poor career choice to go to Ru$$ia I'm sure he would be there
I take deviant's point well though, Higuaín is ghosting into that position right now..but ironically Diego doesn't take either of them into account!
I wanted a trainer (like Bianchi) who would have just made a decision and stuck to it for the good of the team like Pekerman benched an ascendent Tévez for two years in favour of Saviola..honestly I think Saviola-Crespo worked better and think that Saviola's absence against Germany may have been decisive because we really should have gotten 2 or 3 in that match...
I also think we have to accept that Agüero, Zárate, and Tévez are all vying for the same position
you could probably add Messi to that group and leave those 3 geniuses out
if you think about players like Lucho, Aimar, and D'Alessandro your head begins to spin because they arguably deserve it more than Román (in increasing order)
and don't forget Di María :o

at this point I stick by the formation I posted on the previous page

[threervana]

Seems everyone hopes Cavenaghi would stand up. :)Vamos El Torino~~

Messi/Di Maria/Lavezzi - Aguero/Tevez/Zarate - Cavenaghi/Milito/Higuain(?)

What a Pretty Trio~~

[msi2]

Why i have this impression we are never going to see the Messi from Barcelona with the NT? :confused:

[threervana]

Why i have this impression we are never going to see the Messi from Barcelona with the NT? :confused:

Who is our Xavi? Who is our Dani Alvez? Who is our E'to and Henry?
:rolleyes:

[deviant]

Why i have this impression we are never going to see the Messi from Barcelona with the NT? :confused:

He'll be even better for the NT team his presence alone means hes going to be double covered leaving someone open, I have an article in my Champions magazine about Messi if you guys want I can scan it.

[Arg10]

Who is our Xavi? Who is our Dani Alvez? Who is our E'to and Henry?
:rolleyes:

Riquelme could be our Xavi. Xavi doesn't have much speed(granted he's faster than Riquelme), so he could be our Xavi IF he finds his form again. How little we forget how amazing he was in 2006. I really think Maxi is better than Alves. Alves is a good defender, but a great attacker. Maxi can defend and he's a great attacker. Also, Zabaleta isn't too bad. He and Messi have played together several times(2005 U20 World Cup, Olympics) and I found that they linked up with each other pretty well. Granted it means dropping Zanetti, but I think we do have options as to who our "Alves" is. Eto'o and Henry is a different story. We do have them, but we haven't used them. Cavenaghi can be our Eto'o and Aguero, Tevez, Zarate, Lavezzi, Higuain can be our Henry. It's just a matter of getting them to play together for a while. You can't forget that these guys train together everyday from August until June.


I would like to see
Agüero-Cavenaghi-Messi
Cambiasso-Román-Masche(c)
Insua*-Samuel-Demichelis-Zanetti
JP 'Gardel' Carrizo

I wouldn't mind that line-up, IF we could get the same Cambiasso from Inter to play with Argentina and not his twin brother. I swear, Cambiasso for Inter is way different than Cambiasso with Argentina. The only problem I have with the front is Aguero. I love the kid, but he can't play on the wing. I wouldn't mind putting Maxi instead of Aguero(he did play on the left against Serbia and Montenegro... and look how that turned out).

Zarate-Cavenaghi-Messi
Maxi-Román-Masche(c)
Monzon-Samuel-Demichelis-Zanetti
Carrizo

OR

I would like to see
Maxi-Cavenaghi-Messi
Cambiasso-Román-Masche(c)
Insua*-Samuel-Demichelis-Zanetti
Carrizo

He'll be even better for the NT team his presence alone means hes going to be double covered leaving someone open, I have an article in my Champions magazine about Messi if you guys want I can scan it.

I'd like to see it, if you can.

[msi2]

He'll be even better for the NT team his presence alone means hes going to be double covered leaving someone open, I have an article in my Champions magazine about Messi if you guys want I can scan it.


Yeah please, if you can! ;)

Who is our Xavi? Who is our Dani Alvez? Who is our E'to and Henry?
:rolleyes:

I think it's going to be Ronaldinho's case all over again but we will see.

[Arg10]

Did anyone else read/hear about when Diego said that Lisandro Lopez will get a call-up? How many strikers is he planning on calling against France? So far he's said Zarate, Diego Milito, Lopez, Aguero and Tevez(the last 2 are a given). In midfifeld, Cambiasso, Veron and Riquelme. I'll be honest in saying that most of what I've seen from Lopez has been in the Champions League. I know he did very well last year in terms of goals, scoring 24 or something like that. Oh and Diego also said something about using Veron and Riquelme against France?!

Much like everyone here it pisses me off that Cavenaghi isn't getting a mention. Play him against France, whats the worst that could happen? Seriously, it's a friendly in FRANCE, he's scoring goals left and right, why not? Higuain is getting there in terms of being a #9 but of course needs more time. We have alot of strikers, but coaches with shit for brains that can't seem to get them to play together.

Oh and I've recently Youtube'd some Lucho Gonzalez... man I miss this guy:(

[threervana]

Lisandro always got call-up for friendlies or qualifiers in the past two years but he never started as far as I can remember.

Soo no surprise at all if he gets another one~

Waiting for the final list against France!@!

[deviant]

Here is the Messi article I told you guys about I put it in a ZIP file. enjoy :)

http://www.starstore.com/acatalog/barcelona-messi.jpg

Rapidshare

http://rapidshare.com/files/189502230/CLMessiArticle.zip

[Arg10]

Thanks for that deviant. So Messi does watch videos of Maradona on Youtube!

Oh and here's the list against France that was just released.

Goalkeepers: Juan Pablo Carrizo. Sergio Romero

Defenders: Javier Zanetti, Martin Demichelis, Gabriel Heinze, Daniel Díaz, Nicolás Burdisso, Walter Samuel

Midfielders: Javier Mascherano, Fernando Gago, Maximiliano Rodríguez, Jonás Gutiérrez, Luis González, Ángel Di María

Forwards: Lionel Messi, Sergio Agüero, Carlos Tévez, Ezequiel Lavezzi, Lisandro López, Germán Denis

Nay: German Denis? Seriously? Did Maradona do a few lines before submitting this list? No Milito? No Higuain? No Cavenaghi? No Cambiasso? I feel bad for the guy, Maradona did say that he'd be back on the team, guess not right now. Nicolas Burdisso? Does Maradona even WATCH Inter matches to realise that this guy makes Gabriel Heinze look like a million bucks. I'm not too keen on Diaz either. Of course, no Gonzalo from Villarreal. Diego must this that Gonzalo was born on the other side of the River Plate. Seriously though, German Denis?!

Yay: Lucho Gonzalez! Di Maria! Stay healthy this time Angel. MAXIIIIII! Oh and Gutierrez. I've had a soft spot for this guy since the Brazil match last year. No Coloccini! No Pato!

----------Juan Pimp Carrizo---------
Pupi---Samuel---Demichelis---Heinze
------------Mascherano-------------
Maxi--------Gonzalez--------Di Maria
--------Messi----------Lopez--------

Thats my guess for now. Unless we have Zanetti in midfield, and we go 3 in the back. Also, I imagine the South American based players list will be released in a few days?

[DSGB]

You would put Lucho ahead of Román in your starting 11?

[threervana]

You would put Lucho ahead of Román in your starting 11?

:DI'm suprised by that,2.

My guess:

If Diego plays 3 defenders,

Carrizo
Demichelis Samuel Heinze
Maxi Mascherano Gago Di Maria
Riquelme
Messi Aguero?
(Yay, no Pupi:()

If 4 back line

Carrizo
Zanetti Samule Demichelis Heinze
Maxi Masche Gago
Riquelme
Messi Aguero?

I pick Kun just cos he's the son-in-law of Diego:D
Maybe Diego would try Lisandro, we'll see.

[Arg10]

You would put Lucho ahead of Román in your starting 11?

My bad, when making the formation, I just looked at the list. I forgot about Riquelme. Take Gonzalez out and put Riquelme in. And maybe later on in the game sub Riquelme off for Gonzalez or something. But Riquelme gets the start.

Also I guess it means that Veron will be in the squad once the South American list is out.

[west501]

I think our left back may still be coming from the national list..most likely Papa?
as I said before I would like to see Insúa get called up eventually, as he's one of the few bright spots in our current sub20
didn't Diego say he was going to play Román and Verón juntos?
if so, it might be interesting to see

JuamPA 'el Domingo pasado fue un accidente total' Carrizo
Pupi-Micho-Samu-Papa
Verón-Masche(c)
Messi-Román
Agüero-Licha

though we'll likely see Tévez up front :eek:

[Arg10]

I think our left back may still be coming from the national list..most likely Papa?
as I said before I would like to see Insúa get called up eventually, as he's one of the few bright spots in our current sub20
didn't Diego say he was going to play Román and Verón juntos?
if so, it might be interesting to see

JuamPA 'el Domingo pasado fue un acidente total' Carrizo
Pupi-Micho-Samu-Papa
Verón-Masche(c)
Messi-Román
Agüero-Licha

though we'll likely see Tévez up front :eek:

I think he did mention something about playing Veron and Riquelme together, but personally I wouldn't like it. For one, it would mean no Maxi, who was easily our Man Of the Match against Scotland. And 2, it would mean no Di Maria. Take out Veron and have Maxi on the left(hey, it worked versus Serbia and Montenegro) or Di Maria on the left and I'm happy.

Though sadly I think you're right. We will see Tevez up front.

[deviant]

If I had my way this would be my lineup

balanced lineup

----------Juan Pimp Carrizo---------
Pupi---Samuel------Ayala---Heinze
------------Mascherano-------------
Lucho--------Riquelme--------Di Maria
--------Messi----------Higuain--------

against a more attacking team

----------Juan Pimp Carrizo---------
Pupi---Samuel------Ayala---Heinze
------Che Gago--Mascherano------
Riquelme---------------------Lucho
-------Messi----------Aguero------

[msi2]

This is Basile 2.0 the list that Maradona just gave us...

I was exepcting a bit more surprises and we are still seeing some "muertos" called such as Burdisso, Heinze (stop with the Huevos BS por favor) and Denis.
Still no Zabaleta, Gonzalo Rodriguez, no Garay....

I still cant believe Denis is favoured over Cavenaghi or even Milito! lpm....:mad:

EDIT:

About Carrizo,let's hope he wont reiterate his absolutely awful performance of last Sunday or else we could have some bad surprises...

EDIT2:

Apparently Carrizo will be on the bench against Sampdoria...Not really surprising unfortunately.

[west501]

I agree that Diego is not distancing himself much from Basile in terms of player selection (and omission) and in his non-tactical inspirational style
but let's give him a few games to see if he can shore the boys up
it's like with Batista with the U20 side right now, you'd never think those boys could even make it to the mundial sub20, but we may just end up winning it again
same went for the Olympics..remember how we barely made that with Lautaro Acosta's last minute goal...then we went and owned the tournament
well sure if Diego scrapes into the WC I will live some times of stress in the next year, but it won't matter if we win!!!
do I believe this will happen? see sig for now :rolleyes:

[west501]

I still cant believe Denis is favoured over Cavenaghi or even Milito! lpm....:mad:


consider the club he plays for :rolleyes:
speaking of which, did you see Dátolo went to Napoli?? gran momento del pibe
I like him more already :o
at this rate he'll be called up for sure ;)

[msi2]

I have never seen a sub-20 that horrible...
Either it's that generation who didnt mature very well (89-90), either Batista doesnt have a clue of what to do. Either way, it is the worst juvenil selection i have seen in time.

EDIT:

Well, reading Batista's declarations, i think he doesnt have a clue of what to do.

[threervana]

lucky we didn't appoint Batista as our new NT, right~?!:;

[msi2]

I wouldnt be surprised if that generation is simply weaker than the others. A bit of both though. One disturbing trend is as years are passing, our youth selections are playing more and more poorly. We cant say the 2005 sqaud was joga bonito and we only make it because we had Messi, in 2007, the squad wasnt playing very well too and we had to rely only on strong individualities (Aguero, Banega and co.) and well in 2009 the trend is going on. Except this time we have much less individualities to make the difference...

[west501]

lucky we didn't appoint Batista as our new NT, right~?!:;

yes, but we appointed Diego :(:rolleyes:

I wouldnt be surprised if that generation is simply weaker than the others. A bit of both though. One disturbing trend is as years are passing, our youth selections are playing more and more poorly. We cant say the 2005 sqaud was joga bonito and we only make it because we had Messi, in 2007, the squad wasnt playing very well too and we had to rely only on strong individualities (Aguero, Banega and co.) and well in 2009 the trend is going on. Except this time we have much less individualities to make the difference...

I think it's natural that we start to feel a little bit of entitlement at this stage, but so far we make no mistakes at the world cup level
that said, we don't have replacements for the likes of Agüero, Zárate, Messi (who could have played again in Canadá), Moralez, Di María, Banega in this side
the press are hailing Salvio as the new answer, but it's hopeful imo
tomorrow we will face a terrible challenge in Brazil and then Uruguay after that are even stronger
we just need to finish in the top 4 to make the mundial sub20

[msi2]

Salvio is clearly (at least to me) a great promise but you also can see he's only 18y old. Let's hope he wont go to Europe too soon. Still has a lot to learn.

[threervana]

Except this time we have much less individualities to make the difference...

This team is def incomplete as we lost many individualities like Piatti, Di Santo, Mussachio, etc~:cool:

And Batista didn't pick the best team~~:rolleyes:

[west501]

for the mundial, if we make it, he will

[msi2]

This team is def incomplete as we lost many individualities like Piatti, Di Santo, Mussachio, etc~:cool:

And Batista didn't pick the best team~~:rolleyes:


I'm not sure they would have make a huge difference but who knows...

No i'm really asking what has done Batista because when i see those two young CB from Boca, Muñoz and Sauro, i'm stunned to see they are not in in the selection sub-20. How the hell they were missed by Batista, considering that Muñoz played the sudamericano tournament last year he was already very good and Sauro was a regular sub-17 and if i remember correctly, he was part of the of the sub-17 CB with Musacchio. Not only that but he was very good also, except that game against Nigeria we lost 2-0 in the quarterfinals of the sub-17 WC in 2007.

When you compared them to Tobio and both Fernandez... The only reaction that comes to my mind is :eek:

[west501]

completed list (source (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/02/02/seleccion/01851347.html))
it should be noted that Juan Román Riquelme and Sebastian Battaglia are not called up because of injury

Juan Pablo Carrizo, Sergio Romero
Javier Zanetti, Nicolás Burdisso, Walter Samuel, Martín Demichelis, Gabriel Heinze, Daniel Díaz, Emiliano Papa, Marcos Angeleri
Javier Mascherano, Fernando Gago, Maximiliano Rodríguez, Jonás Gutiérrez, Luis González, Daniel Montenegro, Cristian Ledesma, Juan Sebastián Verón
Lionel Messi, Sergio Agüero, Carlos Tevez, Ezequiel Lavezzi, Germán Denis, Lisandro López y Angel Di María.

needless to say, the continued consideration of Díaz and particularly Battaglia really annoys me to no end http://fbtz.com/forum/images/icons/icon13.gif
next wednesday I'd like to see the following

Juampa 'el uno' Carrizo
Angeleri-Demichelis-Samuel-Zanetti
Masche
Messi-Verón-DiMaría
Agüero-Lisandro

[Arg10]

completed list (source (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/02/02/seleccion/01851347.html))
it should be noted that Juan Román Riquelme and Sebastian Battaglia are not called up because of injury

Juan Pablo Carrizo, Sergio Romero
Javier Zanetti, Nicolás Burdisso, Walter Samuel, Martín Demichelis, Gabriel Heinze, Daniel Díaz, Emiliano Papa, Marcos Angeleri
Javier Mascherano, Fernando Gago, Maximiliano Rodríguez, Jonás Gutiérrez, Luis González, Daniel Montenegro, Cristian Ledesma, Juan Sebastián Verón
Lionel Messi, Sergio Agüero, Carlos Tevez, Ezequiel Lavezzi, Germán Denis, Lisandro López y Angel Di María.

needless to say, the continued consideration of Díaz and particularly Battaglia really annoys me to no end http://fbtz.com/forum/images/icons/icon13.gif
next wednesday I'd like to see the following

Juampa 'el uno' Carrizo
Angeleri-Demichelis-Samuel-Zanetti
Masche
Messi-Verón-DiMaría
Agüero-Lisandro

I'm annoyed by Battaglia as well. Fernando Gago and a half-assed Inter version of Cambiasso is better than Battaglia.

If the line-up is similar to the one that you posted, then this is make or break for Veron. He's in the best form he's been in since God knows how long, he's had a decent break and he'll be the drive of the attack alongside Messi. If it doesn't work now, what are the odds of it working when he's a year and a half older in 2010? I'd prefer Gonzalez instead of Veron, but whatever.

[msi2]

What's wrong with Battaglia?

[deviant]

sorry but I dont agree with Gago being worse than el peloncillo cambiasso this how I rate these fellows.

Mascherano===Gago===Cambiasso===Banega===>Battaglia

[west501]

What's wrong with Battaglia?

the national team shirt fits him several sizes too big

[msi2]

the national team shirt fits him several sizes too big

Well honestly that's case of a lot of players today unfortunately.

[Arg10]

the national team shirt fits him several sizes too big

You're telling me you weren't pleased with his performance against Peru?:p

Interesting interview with Veron on FIFA.com. There's even a question about people blaming him on the 2002 World Cup.

Oh and quick question(it's silly), but when has Argentina worn white shorts lately? On every futbol website I visit, they are always selling Argentina Home White Shorts, but I've never seen them wearing it lately. The only time I remember was versus Brazil in 1990. I know they didn't wear it under the new jersey, but what about the 2006 jerseys? It's a silly question, but it's been bugging me all day.

Thanks in advance.

[threervana]

You're telling me you weren't pleased with his performance against Peru?:p

Interesting interview with Veron on FIFA.com. There's even a question about people blaming him on the 2002 World Cup.

Oh and quick question(it's silly), but when has Argentina worn white shorts lately? On every futbol website I visit, they are always selling Argentina Home White Shorts, but I've never seen them wearing it lately. The only time I remember was versus Brazil in 1990. I know they didn't wear it under the new jersey, but what about the 2006 jerseys? It's a silly question, but it's been bugging me all day.

Thanks in advance.


As far as I can remember, 2004 Olympics, that's for sure.~

And the friendly against U.S.A last year~:cool:

And maybe other games, but I can't recall.

[Arg10]

As far as I can remember, 2004 Olympics, that's for sure.~

And the friendly against U.S.A last year~:cool:

And maybe other games, but I can't recall.

Ah! I knew I was forgetting a match(against the U.S). Thanks for the info:D

Some good news(not sure what it'll change) but Sergio Romero has now played 939 minutes with AZ Alkmaar without allowing a goal. I've Youtube'd some AZ video highlights from last month and there are some good saves in there. Also he seems good at saving penalties(I saw maybe 2-3 saves).

If Carrizo doesn't cut it(hopefully he does, *knocks on wood*), Romero would be a good #1. I think he did VERY well in the Olympics considering the circumstances and all.

[west501]

Carrizo will cut it, Diego has said he supports the keeper
if it's motivation Juampa needs, Diego says he will receive it
Lazio lost 0-3 pathetically to Milan over the weekend with their second stringer in net, showing that it's a team thing and Delio Rossi is foolish to take it out on his star keeper

edit: Verón misses another international match due to injury source (http://infobae.com/contenidos/430580-100884-0-Sebastián-Verón-no-jugará-el-amistoso-contra-Francia)
isn't that the same thing that happened against Scotland?
this would be a good time for Diego to call up (and start) el Pipita Higuaín

[Arg10]

Carrizo will cut it, Diego has said he supports the keeper
if it's motivation Juampa needs, Diego says he will receive it
Lazio lost 0-3 pathetically to Milan over the weekend with their second stringer in net, showing that it's a team thing and Delio Rossi is foolish to take it out on his star keeper

edit: Verón misses another international match due to injury source (http://infobae.com/contenidos/430580-100884-0-Sebastián-Verón-no-jugará-el-amistoso-contra-Francia)
isn't that the same thing that happened against Scotland?
this would be a good time for Diego to call up (and start) el Pipita Higuaín

Not sure if he was injured versus Scotland, but if it is I doubt Veron is faking it. Bad timing I suppose.

I'd love to see Higuain get the call. I know alot of people don't want to see him in the squad but there is no way Denis deserves a call-up over Higuain. I guess this means Gonzalez will control the midfield?:confused:

[west501]

I don't know what we should do in midfield, to be honest
this is why we need a systems coach to define roles and delegate responsibility to the players that fill them
I think we could move Zanetti up into central/right mid as he's been doing legendarily well for Inter over the last few seasons
Diego is rumoured to be considering the following 4-3-3 (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/02/09/seleccion/01855657.html)
Carrizo/Romero; Zanetti, DeMichelis, Heinze, Papa; Maxi, Masche(c), Gago; Messi, Tévez, Agüero

and in other news, our u20 died with a whimper last night..no defence of the title in Egypt
for shame, and to think that Batista could have used players like di Santo, Banega, Di María, Piatti, L.Acosta, and even Agüero
I think one of the major issues is that after so much success at this level, we see literally all of those players playing in Europe now
I feel bad for Insúa because with some success at this level he may have stood a chance to make a senior team appearance sooner than he likely will at this point

[msi2]

Nooo! Gonzalo Rodriguez is injured for another month. :(

[west501]

that poor kid is going to have to retire young :(

[Arg10]

I don't know what we should do in midfield, to be honest
this is why we need a systems coach to define roles and delegate responsibility to the players that fill them
I think we could move Zanetti up into central/right mid as he's been doing legendarily well for Inter over the last few seasons
Diego is rumoured to be considering the following 4-3-3 (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/02/09/seleccion/01855657.html)
Carrizo/Romero; Zanetti, DeMichelis, Heinze, Papa; Maxi, Masche(c), Gago; Messi, Tévez, Agüero

and in other news, our u20 died with a whimper last night..no defence of the title in Egypt
for shame, and to think that Batista could have used players like di Santo, Banega, Di María, Piatti, L.Acosta, and even Agüero
I think one of the major issues is that after so much success at this level, we see literally all of those players playing in Europe now
I feel bad for Insúa because with some success at this level he may have stood a chance to make a senior team appearance sooner than he likely will at this point

Jesus, again with the midgets up front? Look, I have nothing against them but they cannot play together at the same time. I think Diego's biassism(is that even a word?!) is getting in the way of picking his starting XI. Messi will start, Tevez he loves so much and Aguero is his son in law. I don't have any real problems with the rest of the line-up. Oh and I know your gonna kill me for this one Guest501 but I'm glad that(even though its rumours) they wrote Carrizo/Romero and not just Carrizo. Romero is doing very well in Holland at the moment and I think there has to be some sort of competition between the 2 goalkeepers. Yes Romero is still young but how old was Casillas in 2002? I know it's a longshot that he'll end up as good as Casillas but the competition needs to be there.

Our U20 side... I don't know what to say. I watched every match of the tournament except for the last one and I must say we looked like shit. The team did not click at all, they played better when they were a man down and losing then they did 11 vs. 11. They did show some heart, coming back from 2-0 to get a draw. They weren't disciplined, the only real bright spot if you can say that was Salvio. Say what you want about Pekerman but the guy was a genius when it came to the youth. I'm still behind Batista though.

[msi2]

I don't know what we should do in midfield, to be honest
this is why we need a systems coach to define roles and delegate responsibility to the players that fill them
I think we could move Zanetti up into central/right mid as he's been doing legendarily well for Inter over the last few seasons
Diego is rumoured to be considering the following 4-3-3 (http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2009/02/09/seleccion/01855657.html)
Carrizo/Romero; Zanetti, DeMichelis, Heinze, Papa; Maxi, Masche(c), Gago; Messi, Tévez, Agüero

and in other news, our u20 died with a whimper last night..no defence of the title in Egypt
for shame, and to think that Batista could have used players like di Santo, Banega, Di María, Piatti, L.Acosta, and even Agüero
I think one of the major issues is that after so much success at this level, we see literally all of those players playing in Europe now
I feel bad for Insúa because with some success at this level he may have stood a chance to make a senior team appearance sooner than he likely will at this point

Banega, Di Maria, Acosta and Aguero were not eligible since they were born in 1988. Only players born at 1989/1/1 and after were able to play. In that list only Piatti and Di Santo would have been able to play (like Insua did) because they were born in 1989.

[west501]

ah ok, I didn't realise that..in any case, those two players could have been instrumental in an attack that did not work at all
as for Diego, he's approaching the team's problem from a motivational standpoint instead of a tactical one for now
let's hope it works and I also hope someone will cap the match tomorrow as I will miss it!