Palazzi wants Juve in Serie C and Milan, Fiorentina and Lazio in Serie B

[Bruun]

http://ekstrabladet.dk/sport/udenlandsk_fodbold/international_fodbold/article208671.ece

Prosecutor Stefano Palazzi wants Juventus in Serie C and Milan, Fiorentina and Lazio in Serie B. And he evens wants them to start with minus points.

According to Reuter, former Juventus director, Antonio Giraudo, in today's hearing told that:

"All sorts of things take place in the world of football. Referees get Rolex watches and the books are being embellished. What I am saying is, that this is a business, where you got to look out for yourself."

The prosecutors demand Antonio Giraudo, Luciano Moggi, Diego and Andrea Della Valle (Fiorentina) and Claudio Lotito (Lazio) to be banned from football for five years and receive a fine of 5000 euro's for each charge, where they are found guilty.

They will have the verdict on the 10th of July, the day after the world cup final.

Appeals have to be over and done with by the 27th of July, because that is when UEFA have their deadline for CL and UEFA cup.



From Channel 4 (http://www.channel4.com/sport/football_italia/jul4i.html)



Calciopoli prosecutor Stefano Palazzi has today called for Juventus to be relegated into Serie C1, as well as urging the sporting tribunal to condemn Milan, Lazio and Fiorentina to Serie B.

[MoFF]

Is it likely that it will happen?

[Mark the Goalkeeper]

Is it likely that it will happen?
very unlikely, but the possibility is there

[MoFF]

That would be extreme

[lfc06]

that would be great

[narduch]

I have a feeling that this will happen. Lazio, Fiorentina and Milan need to be punished, but Juventus' punishment needs to be greater. This is achieved with the proposal.

The thing I find interesting is that some of the proposed punishments for individuals involved seems light.

[killa-cam]

OOOOOO not Fiorentina:mad: again...

[Mark the Goalkeeper]

Juventus 'till I die... no matter where they play!

[killa-cam]

Juventus 'till I die... no matter where they play!
you will soon change your team to Inter...:)

[Jason]

!@#$ Inter

always

Good on them if they've not cheated a lick tho! That's impressive and utterly suprising.

[acricketer]

Sounds like the maximum punishments have been demanded, so there will be a negotiation back from there.

[dbzclips]

you will soon change your team to Inter...:)
No, he's going to Chelsea. :)

[Mark the Goalkeeper]

you will soon change your team to Inter...:)
No fvcking way, i would rather die a horrible death than join those black and blue goons

[deviant]

you will soon change your team to Inter...:)
I would rather die.

amo la vecchia signora

[Sean Jacobs]

I seriously hope that if anything, all these teams get points deduction with Juventus the most. It would be really hard for Serie A in the near future. It will take some time for them to come back as one of the best leagues in Europe... :(

[Dogme]

Fuck Palazzi!

[Yiannis]

Sorry but i just can't keep it inside of me!Inter fans now know they will have a genuine chance winning the championship!:D :p

[Dogme]

Inter will find a way to fuck things up like they normally do. If the best teams get sent to a lower division, then Roma will probably win Serie A or maybe Sampdoria will do it.

[narduch]

The Juventus relegation is now a foregone conclusion:

http://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/Altro_Calcio/Primo_Piano/2006/07_Luglio/05/maxiprocesso05.shtml

I don't have the time for a full translation, but Juve's own lawyer stated that playing in Serie B with a points deduction seems fair. If this is the attitude that the Juve defence team is taking, then their relegation is guaranteed.

[Labfm1]

Inter will find a way to fuck things up like they normally do. If the best teams get sent to a lower division, then Roma will probably win Serie A or maybe Sampdoria will do it.


you really have no clue about this ordeal...

the reason why inter hasn't won anything is because

THESE TEAMS WERE CHEATING TO WIN!

that's the only reason why....you don't worry...
once there is no cheating juve, milan scum in the serie A, inter will do well...

[leoni11]

Juventus 'till I die... no matter where they play!

Agreed with that!

[Dogme]

you really have no clue about this ordeal...

the reason why inter hasn't won anything is because

THESE TEAMS WERE CHEATING TO WIN!

that's the only reason why....you don't worry...
once there is no cheating juve, milan scum in the serie A, inter will do well...

Well, following your 'reasoning' , all the lesser relegation threatened teams that Inter Milan have lost to over the years must have been cheating as well.

You say i have no clue, then you refer to AC Milan as 'scum'. I don't know where Maxxed would be without your insightful comments.

[opm1s6]

Juventus 'till I die... no matter where they play!


Very good for you. We're all glad you are staying loyal. :rolleyes: i personally don't think we care about comments like this. It is meaningless to us. what is meaningful is handing down some severe punishment.

It has been refreshing to see some of the Juve fans agreeing that punishment is necessary. Let's hear more of that.

At this rate Bologna will win the scudetto by default :D probably not :( it would take a lot more than that

[Heusen]

to be honest i really hope some severe punishments are pass down to these teams because it is the only way other teams would thnk twice before doing the same. I even know a Juve fan that boost how many titles they have won and he doesn't care he they bought them or not. he jus care that the club must be rich to be able to do this. (stupid guy) it is time for these cheating clubs to face the music.

[phat]

Like it or not,

1. Inter will never win a scudetto. :p

2. Juve will beat AC Milan, Lazio and Viola in Serie B...:D

3. Juve will be back in Serie A and dominate once again.

[Jason]

I haven't been able to dig up much news on this but from what I've read I'd be suprised if Milan went down. The charges and evidence I've seen in the press against them is weak as hell.

Anyone got any good sources in English?

[Mark the Goalkeeper]

Like it or not,

1. Inter will never win a scudetto. :p

2. Juve will beat AC Milan, Lazio and Viola in Serie B...:D

3. Juve will be back in Serie A and dominate once again.
1. Meh, maybe Roma
2. Amen
3. Amen x100

[narduch]

Chievo will win the next Scudetto :D

[kerle]

i hope juve goes in Serie C


but i'm doubting the italians would do this...

[Mark the Goalkeeper]

i hope juve goes in Serie C


but i'm doubting the italians would do this...
and i hope you fall in a hole

[Dogme]

i hope juve goes in Serie C


but i'm doubting the italians would do this...

Please explain yourself? Why do you want them to be relegated to Serie C?

[narduch]

We may have to wait until Thursday, or as late as Sunday to find out the verdicts.

http://www.channel4.com/sport/football_italia/jul11d.html

I wonder if this has been done on purpose, to reduce the amount of time left for appeals.

The Italian FA needs to tell UEFA who will be in the CL and UC by July 26th.

[johnno]

Please explain yourself? Why do you want them to be relegated to Serie C?

I want to answer this , although it's not directed at me.

If juve did cheat to the extent they did, (which they admitted), then relegating them to Serie C would not be harsh. Their choice to cheat..

[opm1s6]

anyone have a news update?

[phat]

Italian clubs hope World Cup win will bring leniency

ROME, July 11 (Reuters) - Italy's World Cup triumph fuelled demands on Tuesday for the four top clubs caught up in a match-fixing scandal to be treated leniently.


The verdict of a sports tribunal investigating the murky affair had been expected the day after the victorious Azzurri returned home from Germany to a heroes' welcome.


The Italian Football Federation (FIGC) now says there is 'no certainty' about the timing of the verdicts that could lead to the relegation of Juventus, AC Milan, Fiorentina and Lazio.

Local media speculated that the tribunal's rulings could come as late as Friday or Saturday, allowing Italians more time to revel in Sunday's penalty shootout win over France.

Justice Minister Clemente Mastella called for a judgment that 'takes into account the victory in Berlin'.

'Let's do what they did in ancient Rome: whoever has given us prestige and dignity should be treated differently, as one who has done something exemplary,' Mastella said.

Former prime minister Silvio Berlusconi, owner of AC Milan, argued that relegation would hurt fans the most.

'We can't penalise the fans. The individuals should be punished, not the clubs,' he said.

Champions Juventus risk relegation to the third division if found guilty of trying to influence the appointment of match officials for games during the 2004-05 season.

'As a fan, I fear we risk the third division and I invoke the clemency of the tribunal,' said Piero Fassino, head of the Democrats of the Left, one of the ruling coalition parties.

AC Milan, Fiorentina and Lazio face possible relegation to the second tier Serie B while 26 individuals - including club and football federation officials, referees and linesmen - risk bans from their nation's favourite sport.

Italy's World Cup victory in 1982 was followed by an amnesty for those banned after a betting scandal two years earlier.
Despite the outburst of national pride over the World Cup win, the chances of an amnesty appear less certain this time.

FIGC commissioner Guido Rossi has consistently ruled out the possibility of an amnesty and many fans believe Italy's Cup win will not soften the sentences handed down by the tribunal.

'I don't think it will have much of an effect. I'm just hoping they don't come down too hard on Lazio,' said Manuel De Paolis, 19, a supporter of the Rome-based club.

'They don't seem to be as involved as the other teams. We'll just have to see.'

[orange22]

Also, UEFA has apparently said that if there is an "amnesty" situation such as in '82, all Italian teams will be banned from European competition. So that pretty much rules that out!

[chauchey]

Please explain yourself? Why do you want them to be relegated to Serie C?

I think that all the clubs that have been caught up in this scandle, cheating for the second time, should be banned to the serie C. The teams need to learn that this is unacceptable, and will come with increasingly harsher penalties as time goes on. As sad as I am to see AC/Lazio caught up in this. They are two of my more liked teams. :(

[Bruun]

Alright... the verdict is getting pretty close and today La Stampa (http://www.lastampa.it/sport/cmsSezioni/scandalocalcio/200607articoli/2526girata.asp) reveals that Juve will play in Serie B and Milan with start the season with minus 9 points. I think Lazio and Fiorentina will start with minus 15.

Because Italy have won the World Cup, they will go light on them.


SCANDALO CALCIO

CRESCE IL PARTITO PERDONISTA DOPO LA CONQUISTA DEL MONDIALE SI FANNO SEMPRE PIÙ FORTI LE PRESSIONI PER PENE PIÙ LEGGERE

Mastella: Milan in A con 9 punti in meno E la Juve andrà in B

Il ministro della Giustizia si confida con i suoi: «Per Fiorentina e Lazio solo penalizzazioni»

Read it all here: http://www.lastampa.it/sport/cmsSezioni/scandalocalcio/200607articoli/2526girata.asp

The final verdict is coming up soon...

[eurotrash]

And here (http://www.lastampa.it/redazione/cmsfoto/20060712070854_juve_ricostruzione/galleria.asp) is the list of Juve players who are leaving/staying.

[no_frills_billy]

cheating scum should definetly be handed out severe punishments. I see Juve losing most of their star players if they are relegated to serie c or b coz of salary cap. too much shit happening with Juve atm i dont see them getting themselves promoted anytime soon. people suiciding, whole of management resigning, new coaches, new players plus possible points deduction, all of these factors point to Juve staying in serie b or c for at least 2 seasons.


After they get promoted they will not be able to compete for players no champions league e.t.c. will mega financial set backs for competing in lower divisions lack of sponsorship e.t.c. their stars which stay on will age, tarnished reputation, which self respectable footballer will go to Juve now?

Truth Hurts but Juve is a sinking boat.

[phat]

Investigator: No clemency for scandal clubs

The four clubs involved in Serie A's match-fixing scandal will not be granted amnesty as a result of Italy's World Cup success, according to Italian Football Federation chief investigator Francesco Borrelli.


The country is still celebrating the national team's success in Germany following their penalty shootout win over France on Sunday.

However, the Azzurri's triumph will not change the course of the trial currently taking place in Rome.

Juventus, AC Milan, Fiorentina and Lazio are expected to learn their fate in the next few days, with the quartet facing relegation if found guilty of wrongdoing.

'I believe the disciplinary procedure should have no connection with the victory,' said Borrelli on Wednesday.

'If we say that a victory should lead to indulgence, then surely a defeat would have brought more extreme measures of severity.

'We are therefore talking about two different things.'

Borrelli was saddened by Marcello Lippi's decision to step down as coach of the national team.

'As an Italian, I am upset,' he said. 'Especially after such a beautiful victory and a great tournament.'

Borrelli did not comment on when the verdict on the match-fixing trial would be given.

Reports in Italy suggest it could be announced on Friday afternoon, once the stock exchange closes. Both Lazio and Juventus are listed on the stock exchange.

Once the verdict is announced, the clubs will have three days to appeal to the Federal Court.

The FIGC must hand UEFA the lists of teams which will be involved in European competitions by July 25.

[phat]

Juventus sporting director Alessio Secco has warned clubs interested in their players that they face a tough task to prise their stars away from the Stadio Delle Alpi.

The Old Lady are facing up to the prospect of relegation from Serie A after being embroiled in the centre of a match-fixing scandal involving four clubs and 26 officials.

If found guilty, Juventus could be relegated to Serie C, with their top players expected to depart the club.

However, Secco has issued a warning to teams interested in their players, insisting Juve are not looking to sell.

"We are trying to make other clubs understand that we are not a store, but obviously, it's not easy," he told L'Espresso.

Secco remains confident that Juve will only be demoted to Serie B and believes that if that is the case, they will be able to keep the majority of their players at the club.

"We don't want to think about Serie C, maybe we can work to restart from Serie B," he continued.

"In this case we want to be thinking immediately about Serie A and entering the Champions League places. This is our strategy.

"So we can't demolish our squad, we need to keep a strong side, even if it is expensive. It's better than having to rebuild it later.

"Earning money is not our priority at the moment."

[KOPKING5]

'Juve Relegated To Serie B'
According to reports emerging from Italy, Juventus have been relegated to Serie B with a 15-points deduction for their part in the match-fixing scandal. Lazio & Fiorentina will also be demoted, while AC Milan will stay in Serie A but thrown out of the Champs
http://www.football365.com/

[saurabh]

Source - Gazzetta dello Sport

Juventus have been relegated and docked 20 points as a result of their involvement in match-fixing.

Gazzetta dello Sport states that all the clubs have been informed of their punishments and that Juventus will be joined in Serie B by Fiorentina and Lazio. They will also all be docked points.

It is also claimed that AC Milan will remain in Serie A but will have a 10 to 15 point deduction.

The official verdict will be announced at 6pm today.

[phat]

[B][B]It is also claimed that AC Milan will remain in Serie A but will have a 10 to 15 point deduction.

If thats the case then Berlusconi that pig was definately involved in making sure Milan stay in Serie A.

[Dogme]

If thats the case then Berlusconi that pig was definately involved in making sure Milan stay in Serie A.

Obviously nothing has been decided yet, but as soon as i read what people expect the punishments to be for the various clubs, i thought about Berlusconi to. If Juve and the other clubs are relegated, then Milan should be to, simple as that.

[Vito Corleone]

Someone should go to jail for much bigger fraud than fixing football matches, if this kind of information really leaked and no official stock exchange announcement was made immediately.

[narduch]

So far this is only media speculation.

Different media outlets are reporting different sentences.

Let's wait for the actual judgement.

[DriveShot]

So it looks like Juve, Lazio and Fiorentina will be going to Serie B while AC Milan will stay in Serie A but lose their Champions League spot. Juve will lose 20 points, Fiorentina will lose 10, and Lazio about 5 or 6. So if this holds up it should be Inter and Roma in the Champions League and Chievo Verona and Palermo to qualify with Livorno, Parma, and Empoli for the UEFA Cup. This is probably a dream come true for those lower ranking teams.


Source (http://www.eurosport.com/football/serie-a/2006-2007/sport_sto925487.shtml)

Edit: Moved to this thread as this is just speculation untill we have a final verdict

[Jason]

If thats the case then Berlusconi that pig was definately involved in making sure Milan stay in Serie A.

As I've been saying for weeks, there's appears to be no evidence against Milan that would warrant prosecution. Do you know of some evidence that I don't?

If Juve and the other clubs are relegated, then Milan should be to, simple as that.

Based on what? The fact that they're one of the top clubs and have been accused?

Berlusconi's a bit dodgy I concede but I also maintain that I've seen no evidence, in fact from what I have seen, Milan is caught up in a witch hunt PR campaign of a trial and deserves even less.

Of course, as I've said here and in other threads, this is based on the evidence I've heard, and I really haven't been able to find too much in English. I welcome (and again request) evidence against Milan if anyone has it.

This has been a galvanizing subject and I'm quite glad to have shared in some feeling of fraternity with some rival supporters who are normally over the top and irrational when it comes to their lack of respect for a rival. I'd be hating to see this thread degrade into an irrational "this team sucks because they're not my team" discussion.

[CoachG]

According to La Gazzetta dello Sport, the FIGC has handed down the verdict with the following sentences:

Juventus: Relegated to Serie B with a 15 points deficit, likely loose one of its titles.

Lazio and Fiorentina: Relegated to Serie B with a 6 or 7 points deficit

Milan: Remains in Serie A, but looses its European spot altogether, it is unclear if they will have any points deficit, but the article suggest that they'll be handicapped.


http://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/Altro_Calcio/Primo_Piano/2006/07_Luglio/14/sentenze.shtml

MOVED: this is the same article that was quoted earlier today

[narduch]

The verdict will now be announced at 20:00 Italian time, or 2:00 pm EST.

[kidujp]

The verdict will now be announced at 20:00 Italian time, or 2:00 pm EST.

I thought it was supposed to be announced in abt 5 mis. At 13.00 EST.

[varun]

I thought it was supposed to be announced in abt 5 mis. At 13.00 EST.
in 1hrs time according to BBC

and is it confirmed that Milan are out of the CL already? cause i saw it on a news channel teletext today

[narduch]

in 1hrs time according to BBC

and is it confirmed that Milan are out of the CL already? cause i saw it on a news channel teletext today

Nothing is confirmed yet. But that will most likely happen.

[DriveShot]

I still think there isnt any solid evidence against Milan, its going to cost the club millions not playing in Europe.

[Mark the Goalkeeper]

Amnesty my Italian ass...