Barca starting line-up

[sccr_11]

what do you guys think about barca starting line-up this season

[R9magia]

I don't think it will change much at all. Thuram will be the best centre-back who doesn't start in the world. That is the luxury Barcelona have after this move. They don't have to worry too much about an injury to Edmilson, Belletti, Oleguer, Sylvinho or Gio anymore.

-----------------Valdez----------------
---------------------------------------
-----------Marquez----Puyol-----------
-Zambrotta---------------------Gio----
----------------Edmilson---------------
---------------------------------------
-----------Xavi--------Deco----------
--Giuly-----------------------Ronaldinho
---------------------------------------
-----------------Eto'o-----------------

If Edmilson is injured I think they would bring in Thuram and move Marquez up to the DMF role. And SOONER OR LATER Messi will Start!! Sooner rather than later I think. In any case, Barcelona will have a monster bench....Van Bommel, Thuram, Messi/Giuly, Belletti...:eek:

[kidujp]

^^ That's pretty much what I've been thinking too. I expect to see Messi and Iniesta\van Bommel coming in as subs for Guily and Xavi\Deco during the early part of the season and slowly towards the later part of the season, Messi starting with Guily coming on as sub.

I also expect to see Zambrotta switching to the left and either thuram or baletti coming on for Gio and playing in the right. Another defensive sub might be Thuram for Marquez and Puyol alternating every game giving them both some rest. Also Thuram could come in as a sub for edmilson...and pushing Marquez to def mid and thuram staying at defence.

And depending on how Gudjohnson learns the system, he might come in place of Guily too. All depends on Eto'o again maintaining his form up front.

[Dee]

Its the best in the world is what I think.. There is no better team on paper, put that with a coach as rijkaard who teaches complete football, its a dream team. I think Cryuff as just been surpassed... for the greatest barca team ever.. other than the goalkeeper position, barca i think have the best players in every position or at least the top 6 in the world.

I think Messi will start the season off.. Not Guily. Are you guys mad...And I do see gio startin on the left and Zambrotta on the right but i like this line-up better..
And the bench is deep.. I will not go there. But I will say Iniesta is the greatest.. My Favorite Young Player. A Xavi replicate.....

Heres my line-up.

------------------------------Valdes(Not the best keeper)-----------------
----Belletti----------------Puyol-----------Marquez-----------Zambrotta---


---------------------------------Edmilson---------------------------------------------------Xavi----------------------------Deco---------------------------

---Messi--------------------------------------------------#1 in the world----

----------------------------------Eto'----------------------------------------

[barcalove]

firstly.. sorry for the long post! :o

mostly what i think (about what you guys have said).. with exception of giuly and puyol. giuly, i cant see him starting.. just seems more logical for messi to start as he was already there last season until he was injured. now that hes fit why would giuly move back into his place? i see giuly as an almost permanent role player from now on, messi will emerge more and more as one of the most important players on the field. it will be great to have giuly for all the other "smaller" competitions aswell. also, puyol doesnt get subbed! only once in a blue moon does he come off the field.

the only other thing that i hope for is that frank fully uses zambrotta's versatility to experiment with what is the strongest lineup. i like belletti alot and i want him to start, i also am fond of gio but i think belletti is a better fullback. so for me, zambo on the left and belletti on the right is sexy. but i wont complain if zambrotta starts more often on the right as i love him too. its a hard life being a barca fans these days :) haha i see me and dee are thinking alike as far as the fullbacks go :) but really barca has such great depth on both sides of the field (gio/sylvinho/zambrotta on the left.. then zambrotta/belletti/thuram/oleguer... even carles! on the right) that whatever frank throws out there will be strong. and if it doesnt work he just has to make a change or two to bring on fullbacks that are just as capable, if not better.

i like that idea you guys had where maybe frank will take off one of the fullbacks (belletti or gio/sylvinho) and switch zambrotta's side and put on belletti or gio/sylvinho. although going by last year frank doesnt mess with the left side that much during a match, but freely used one of his substitutions to switch belletti and oleguer.

as far as guddy goes.. he is flexible enough to come on for messi or giuly.. or to come on for deco or van bommel. he could even come on for eto'o and play center forward, although eto'o doesnt really like being subbed and typically finishes most matches he plays.

thuram i can see being a good "shut em down" sub late in the game, but im sure he'll get some starts here and there as the season progresses and various reasons why certain players cannot start come into play. but i see him as being a secondary player to fill holes for most of the season.

another i'd like to talk about is iniesta.. its seriously unfortunate that he is relegated to the bench for eternity, as i see him being just as good if not better at times than xavi or deco. i love deco, but i have to admit that i wouldnt be that sad to see him go at one point down the road simply to make room for iniesta to take his rightful place in the starting XI.

valdes
zambrotta - puyol - marquez - gio
edmilson
xavi - deco
messi - eto'o - ronnie

valdes
belleti - puyol - marquez - zambrotta
edmilson
xavi - deco
messi - eto'o - ronnie

those two are the strongest lineups possible... and i concede that the first is probably the most likely. only frank knows for sure.. and im sure at this point he hasnt a clue yet.

subs in order of importance (for me):
iniesta, gudjohnsen, giuly, van bommel, thuram, oleguer, motta, jorquera, sylvinho, ezquerro

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/3346/squadqg9.png

after looking at the above roster, i somehow just realized that barca is a bit short in the striking department. as far as out and out centre forwards go, there is only eto'o and gudjohnen.. and maybe ezquerro if you can consider him one. lets hope that eto'o proves to be as hardy as he was the last two years!

edit: oops! i knew i forgot someone.. i didnt leave out giuly intentionally

[kidujp]

playing around a bit, How abt this for one of the tight CL away games where not conceding is the main isuue.

How abt it for this last 4. :p

----------------Valdes------------------

-Thuram ---Marquez ----Puyol ---Zam---

---------------Edmilson-----------------

-------Xavi ------Deco/V.Bommel -------

--Messi\Guily-------------------Ronnie--

------------------Eto'o-----------------

And taking Thuram off and getting Baletti in or subbing in Gio and switching Zambrotta around for Home games.

Like BL said, The most worrying aspect of this squad is how much we depend on Ronnie and Eto'o to score. Last year Ronnie had a great year - scoring wise and Eto'o continued from where he left off. Hope Eto'o can continue on from there this time around too. A messi will contribute a few more than he did last time.

[R9magia]

^ 3 Things Barcalove

1) You think Messi will start over Giuly right from the beginning of the season?

2) In your line-up (with Messi starting) you don't consider Giuly one of the important subs, or was that a mistake?

3) I just don't understand why you and Dee prefer leaving Gio and Sylvinho on the bench as opposed to having just Belletti on the bench. Also, this goes back to what I said in the other thread. Belletti is a very good overall back, but both Sylvinho and Gio are more skilled on the ball and are better going forward. It would be wise to leave one of these skilled players on the left to link up with Dinho while having the best overall wing-back in the world (arguably) Zambrotta on the right. I'm sure this is what Rijkaard will end up doing (although Zambrotta could fill in every now and then).

EDIT: Kidugp, in that situation (tight CL game in which you're trying to defend a lead) why leave Belletti out (he's a good defensive tough tackling back)?

If you really want to tighten things up at the back, you can play with two DMF's, for example:

------------Valdez------------
--------Thuram-Puyol---------
-Belletti--------------Zambrotta
------Marquez-Edmilson--------
------------Deco--------------
--Messi---------------Ronaldinho
------------Eto'o-------------

[kidujp]

EDIT: Kidugp, in that situation (tight CL game in which you're trying to defend a lead) why leave Belletti out (he's a good defensive tough tackling back)?

If you really want to tighten things up at the back, you can play with two DMF's, for example:

------------Valdez------------
--------Thuram-Puyol---------
-Belletti--------------Zambrotta
------Marquez-Edmilson--------
------------Deco--------------
--Messi---------------Ronaldinho
------------Eto'o-------------


Yes...what you said is an option, but even last year when we didn't have the luxury of zambrotta and thuram, Raijkaard preferred to have a fully fit Baletti come off the bench ( he did win it for us in the end). I don't expect frank to do anything but that again. The way I see it Thuram has infinitely more big time experience than Baletti and I'm guessing that frank and the think-tank at braca will see it that way. The reason I see for baletti not starting in the Cl finals is Frank tend to prefer players who stays back and defend and he's confident of his strike force he has up front...and thuram is just that - one who sits back and defend.

I'm sure that we will see a dry run of these future CL formations in the pre-season and early-season games and they'll go with the best option.

[jr!]

No, no mistake, Barcalove's dislike of Giuly is legendary in these parts!!
:p



2) In your line-up (with Messi starting) you don't consider Giuly one of the important subs, or was that a mistake?

[chauchey]

lol jr! funny stuff mate. I think Messi will start every game he's healthy. I think Eto'o will continue to be in fine form, and wont get hurt, because theres going to be between 4-6 defenders trying to cover Messi and Ronnie. Anyone think theres a better striking trio in the world? Not me!! :D

[bobkat]

Well there are a lot of interesting options out there! One thing that I don't think will happen (that many of you feel will) is marques in the DMF position. I don't think we'll see him there in this system. I think thuram will be an unlikely sub for edmilson except in very important clean-sheet games. I think of the time he will start when he plays not get subbed in (though that's bound to happen sometimes).


valdez
zambo-puyol-marquez-gio
edmilson
xavi-deco
messi-eto'o-dinho

Pretty much standard. I think messi will start more often than giuly through the season. I think also gio will start more often than sylvinho. I think as barcalove does about iniesta. This guy can be WOW. I remember very few matches where he didn't come in and truly control midfield play. Excellent midfielder and I think he deserves starts as much as xavi or deco - but just doesn't have the panache yet. So here is my sub list by position and importance of player.

keeper: jorquera
backs: belletti, sylvinho
DMF: vbommel, motta
MF: iniesta, vbommel, gudjohnson
F: giuly, gudjohnson
CF: gudjohnson, ezquerro

[barcalove]

1) You think Messi will start over Giuly right from the beginning of the season?

2) In your line-up (with Messi starting) you don't consider Giuly one of the important subs, or was that a mistake?

3) I just don't understand why you and Dee prefer leaving Gio and Sylvinho on the bench as opposed to having just Belletti on the bench. Also, this goes back to what I said in the other thread. Belletti is a very good overall back, but both Sylvinho and Gio are more skilled on the ball and are better going forward. It would be wise to leave one of these skilled players on the left to link up with Dinho while having the best overall wing-back in the world (arguably) Zambrotta on the right. I'm sure this is what Rijkaard will end up doing (although Zambrotta could fill in every now and then).
1. yes i do :) messi is infinitely better than giuly, not much else to it than that. but its great to have the little frenchman as a backup. i have bitched and whined and moaned so much about giuly.. but at the end of the day he scored one of the most important goals in barca's history against milan and he has started to win me over (slightly). people speculated that he wasnt playing up to his potential the last 2 seasons, i hope that is true and that somehow he finds more consistent and efficient form. but as it stands, messi all the way.

2. ya it was a mistake.. i was so sure i had left someone out.. lo and behold it was giuly :o i edited my post

3. i disagree that gio and sylvinho are more skilled on the ball.. gio has his past as a midfielder which probably gives him the edge over the other two. but sylvinho is a total mess on the final ball. he can sprint yes, he can give the first ball in a one-two yes.. but when he gets anywhere near the 18 yard box he almost never delivers a good ball. he helps ronnie with the link up play, but its only effective when ronnie is the one that takes the ball into a scoring position. gio almost never gets as far forward as either sylvinho or belletti, so im not sure how you can say that gio is better going forward. he always seems wary of his own lack of pace to commit far up the field. belletti on the other hand, has pace, skill and the ability to beat defenders... plus he can whip in a great cross with more consistency than sylvinho and gio (but only because gio almost never is in position to do so). also i always feel that if belletti is in an advanced position he is the one that has more chance of scoring a goal than any other fullback (again because gio doesnt get that far forward, otherwise his shooting skill would favour him in this department).

whats the big deal anyway? if it isnt working out frank can take out belletti and put gio on, switch zambo to the right and its all good. i wouldnt suggest having both left backs on the bench if belletti and zambo started, just one. they rotate anyway, so they know that only one will play on any given day.

do you think that zambrotta wont be able to link up well with ronnie? haha... i can only have wet dreams of watching the best fullback in the world work with the best footballer in the world.

[Kaiser88]

all i have to say is that frank will surely have a tough time determining who will play and who stays on the bench. but yeah, i agree with barcalove that messi should start instead of giuly. why leave a person with such talent and potential on the bench? :cool:

[Dee]

I just have to say this is the best thread I've been apart of in a while.. Anyone who is going back and forth about how to assemble such a great team is good with me...

All the comments make sense and thats why rijkaard will have so much trouble. We are like coaches right now because this is exactly what they do before the games.. Analyze everyone's position... Its great...

Keep all the Barca comments flowin. If anyone can think up a new barca topic post it... Though this is the only relevant one right now....

Oh and once again Iniesta is the greatest.. I honestly think that he should start.. He worked and paid his dues to Barca and right now my boy Deco has his position not xavi.. Xavi will start until he loses magic(He's our next captain)..

Deco has this year to be on top of his game or you will see iniesta take is place next to xavi.. Deco is great but can be careless at times and very hot headed.. I've watched him and he gives the ball away alot trying to do too much in the center. But he makes up for it with his general like prescence going forward and starting the attack.
Deco is first choice but watch out cause iniesta will not settle for being a sub much longer.......

[west501]

messi >> giuly
messi had won the starting role by the first real madrid game last season (november wasn't it?) but lost it through injury
I fully expect him to be the starter this season
I like barça's transfers because they add to the starting 11 rather than try to change it

[R9magia]

1. yes i do :) messi is infinitely better than giuly, not much else to it than that. but its great to have the little frenchman as a backup. i have bitched and whined and moaned so much about giuly.. but at the end of the day he scored one of the most important goals in barca's history against milan and he has started to win me over (slightly). people speculated that he wasnt playing up to his potential the last 2 seasons, i hope that is true and that somehow he finds more consistent and efficient form. but as it stands, messi all the way.
No question that Messi's better, I'm just not as convinced as you're that he'll start from the beginning. For the good football, I hope he does.
3. i disagree that gio and sylvinho are more skilled on the ball.. gio has his past as a midfielder which probably gives him the edge over the other two. but sylvinho is a total mess on the final ball. he can sprint yes, he can give the first ball in a one-two yes.. but when he gets anywhere near the 18 yard box he almost never delivers a good ball. he helps ronnie with the link up play, but its only effective when ronnie is the one that takes the ball into a scoring position. gio almost never gets as far forward as either sylvinho or belletti, so im not sure how you can say that gio is better going forward. he always seems wary of his own lack of pace to commit far up the field. belletti on the other hand, has pace, skill and the ability to beat defenders... plus he can whip in a great cross with more consistency than sylvinho and gio (but only because gio almost never is in position to do so). also i always feel that if belletti is in an advanced position he is the one that has more chance of scoring a goal than any other fullback (again because gio doesnt get that far forward, otherwise his shooting skill would favour him in this department).
We'll just disagree on this one. Belletti is many things, but a skilled player on the ball he's not IMO. I cringe everytime I see him try to take a defender one on one (which is why I never wanted him on the seleção, even back in his younger days playing in Brasil).
whats the big deal anyway? if it isnt working out frank can take out belletti and put gio on, switch zambo to the right and its all good. i wouldnt suggest having both left backs on the bench if belletti and zambo started, just one. they rotate anyway, so they know that only one will play on any given day.
No big deal. Barça is well served no matter what they do. There really is no bad option in this situation, I just think the better one is Zambrotta on the right and Gio/Sylvinho on the left. I'm pretty sure that's what Rijkaard will do but we'll have to wait and see. You never know, maybe Sylvinho or Gio will be moved before the season starts.
do you think that zambrotta wont be able to link up well with ronnie? haha... i can only have wet dreams of watching the best fullback in the world work with the best footballer in the world.
Sure he will, but I believe in chemistry. I don't think things are always as simple as they seem. Zambrotta > Sylvinho, for example, doesn't automatically mean Zambrotta + Ronaldinho will link better than Sylvinho + R10. We'll see what happens though. Again, Barça will be well served no matter what Rijkaard decides to do.

[Vip]

We'll just disagree on this one. Belletti is many things, but a skilled player on the ball he's not IMO. I cringe everytime I see him try to take a defender one on one (which is why I never wanted him on the seleção, even back in his younger days playing in Brasil).



Wow ... there seems to be many coaches with many different inclinations. I differ from the 2 of you in some main things and agree on others. :eek:

To me, Belletti is a much better attacking player than a defensive player. Defensively, his style is aggressive yet clumsy ... which ends up in a yellow every other game. He is a liability in the red card department, and leaves too much space for his player to cross.

Belletti's strength is his speed, which gives opportunity to a surprise attack playing 1-2 against the defender. His speed helps him get back to defend fast, but his tackling skill is below Oleguer's, reason why Oleguer was the starter last year.

But Belletti is not skillful (here I agree with R9magia and not with BL) when compared to Gio or Silvinho. His asset is speed.

Finally, I also agree with R9magia in that there is something called chemistry between players. Both Ronnie and Sylvinho do understand themselves "magically" ... it is what some coaches call "small societies" inside a football team. Yet, the better player to build up with the mids and forwards is Gio, as the line-up last season proved.



.

[R9magia]

To me, Belletti is a much better attacking player than a defensive player. Defensively, his style is aggressive yet clumsy ... which ends up in a yellow every other game. He is a liability in the red card department, and leaves too much space for his player to cross.
We basically agree here. My only point was that he's a very good overall fullback (obviously defense included) although I do agree with your analysis of his clumsiness and rough defensive style. Overall though, I think it's fair to say he is a good defensive fullback (even with his faults).
Belletti's strength is his speed, which gives opportunity to a surprise attack playing 1-2 against the defender. His speed helps him get back to defend fast, but his tackling skill is below Oleguer's, reason why Oleguer was the starter last year.
Agree 100%
But Belletti is not skillful (here I agree with R9magia and not with BL) when compared to Gio or Silvinho. His asset is speed.
Obviously agree.
Finally, I also agree with R9magia in that there is something called chemistry between players. Both Ronnie and Sylvinho do understand themselves "magically" ... it is what some coaches call "small societies" inside a football team. Yet, the better player to build up with the mids and forwards is Gio, as the line-up last season proved.
And again obviously I agree 100%. I don't think we disagree on anything here. Looks like you're with me as far as Belletti goes :D

[skb]

Valdes

Thuram Puyol Marquez Zambrotta


Deco Edmilson Xavi



Messi Eto'o Ronaldinho