Raul sacked...

[Bruun]

http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/0,,1884099,00.html

Raul was today dropped by Spain for the first time in ten years. The Real Madrid striker was left out of the Spain squad for next week's Euro 2008 qualifier against Sweden and a friendly with Argentina.


Full Squad:

Iker Casillas (Real Madrid)
Pepe Reina (Liverpool);

Antonio Lopez (Atletico Madrid)
Pablo Ibanez (Atletico Madrid)
Carles Puyol (Barcelona)
Juanito (Real Betis)
Joan Capdevila (Deportivo Coruna)
Sergio Ramos (Real Madrid)

Cesc Fabregas (Arsenal)
Jose Antonio Reyes (Real Madrid)
Andres Iniesta (Barcelona)
Xavi (Barcelona)
Luis Garcia (Liverpool)
Xabi Alonso (Liverpool)
David Albelda (Valencia)
Miguel Angel Angulo (Valencia)

Fernando Torres (Atletico Madrid)
David Villa (Valencia).

[DriveShot]

Wow...I figured he was just ride the bench if anything but to be left out completely.

[realGaurab]

And this happening after he scored two in one match after a long long time .....

[michelco]

still no Vicente. Aragones must have something personal against him..

[R9magia]

Took long enough.

[Zico]

You don't perform... you don't play... hats of Luis.

I love Raul because he is the symbol of RM... but lets be honest he hasn't deserved to play for the national team nor start for his club. One game is not enough to be called up!

I hope he has regained his form but over the last 3 years he has 2 or 3 games followed by 6 or 7 miserable one... so hope this is the end of it and he is the Raul of old... then he should get his national call up.

[DanneS]

It doesn't help us... we will lose that game. How could Mellberg stop David Villa from scoring?

[R9magia]

And to add to that, this is the way it should be for anybody. Including Ronaldo with Brasil. If you prove you're one of the best strikers in the country you get called up, if not, you don't. What you did in the past should have nothing to do with call ups now. So it's not just with Raul I feel this way, but with anybody.

[deviant]

I'd rather both Raul and Ronaldo take a rest from their country and focus on their club. :D

[DriveShot]

Hopefully this motivated Raul to score a hattrick against Atletico on Sunday. :D

[vemerez]

It was going to happen one day. Hold your head up Raul it was a good run while it lasted.

¡Que tengas suerte! to Ronaldo and Raul :)

[cartbran]

Spain has not lived up to expectations. I think it is probably about time. Especially considering that there are so many young guys with a lot of talent that deserve a shot at proving themselves.

I don't doubt that he'll be back in the side for one last match. Whether he makes the selection of Euro2008 as his last hurrah or get called up for some later qualifiers. But it is probably safe to assume that he will not be making an appearance in South Africa in 2010.

[sccr_11]

It doesn't help us... we will lose that game. How could Mellberg stop David Villa from scoring?
tackle villa:D and take him out the game:)

[AloneSoul]

It doesn't help us... we will lose that game.

That's the spirit :D

[chauchey]

You don't perform... you don't play... hats of Luis.

I love Raul because he is the symbol of RM... but lets be honest he hasn't deserved to play for the national team nor start for his club. One game is not enough to be called up!

I hope he has regained his form but over the last 3 years he has 2 or 3 games followed by 6 or 7 miserable one... so hope this is the end of it and he is the Raul of old... then he should get his national call up.

I wish more coaches on big teams would coach like that. I heard a quote from brian burke(NHL GM) the other day, and he said "sucessfull teams are the ones that let the managers do their jobs without ownership interfierence." I couldnt agree with this more. I believe that there is alot of pressure to let these big names play.
Really, when you think of it, some of these players show sparks of brilliance(which could in some cases be luck, although not in rauls case, who played very well for a long period of time) and then have fantastic media/ad/publicty campains promoting them. After that, theres alot of people who want to see what the hype is about, or dont watch the games but still have an opinion anyways, and the wrong people start influencing decisions based on pressure or stress they're feeling, when really they have no business being in the decision making process of the starting XI.
Its kind of like Britney Spears. Semi talented, fantastic media campain surounding her, good to look at. Doesnt sing very well(sings ok) live(but lip syncs as good as anyone....yes, its true...i've picked out some bad transitions during a live preformance). I use this illustration because of the media campain surround both her, and lets say...raul or beckam, or any other consistant underpreforming superstar who sells jerseys and has a good face.
It goes to show that if you're good looking and personable enough to make the right people money, you can find yourself in a fantastic, and semi untouchable position, provided you continue to make the right poeple money.

[praro]

Raul have always played well with the National Team, probably these years haven't been the best for him, but i still don't understand how Luis Aragones have not called Raúl, Morientes(he has scored some goals in this season) and Vicente (he has played very well last matches). Raúl out, well, but what have Torres done to be in the NT?? NOTHING. He is the most over-rated player i have seen in Spain is some years.
I don't have trust in the NT because all the competitions they do the same, but without Raúl i don't think they can win Sweden, although i want they win, i don't think they will do.

ARAGONÉS DIMISIÓN!!

[DanneS]

That's the spirit :D
I hope to prove myself wrong again. ;)

[deviant]

tackle villa:D and take him out the game:)
tackle Xavi, Puyol take them out of the whole season! :p

[Rev]

lets say...raul or beckam, or any other consistant underpreforming superstar who sells jerseys and has a good face.

Wrong, Beckham has been consistant for Real and pretty much driving England as far as they could go in WC06. Also, Becks has been dropped from the England squad and Real's starting XI. I don't get why people just love to bash Becks. Raul, on the other hand, is still a starter for Real even though he got sacked by Spain. I wish Capello sooner or later drop Raul out of the starting XI. To me, Raul's case and Beckham's is not quite the same, it seems Raul has been dropped for this game but not so permanant as to Becks for England.

[DriveShot]

Its funny how people always have to bash Beckham. He saved England in the WC and performed pretty well IMHO, extremely well compared to most of the other "superstars" on the team. He had a very good season with Real last year and was very consistent. I thought Beckham wasnt starting because he's still coming off from injury.

[taibtariq]

Wrong, Beckham has been consistant for Real and pretty much driving England as far as they could go in WC06. Also, Becks has been dropped from the England squad and Real's starting XI. I don't get why people just love to bash Becks. Raul, on the other hand, is still a starter for Real even though he got sacked by Spain. I wish Capello sooner or later drop Raul out of the starting XI. To me, Raul's case and Beckham's is not quite the same, it seems Raul has been dropped for this game but not so permanant as to Becks for England.

Beckham is not consistant for real madrid and england..he is the biggest reason real madrid is in this situation...figo is much better then, now and in the near future compare to beckham...not to mention robinho and reyes...beckham does nothing good except than occassional crosses..he can't drible, very stiff, cannot compete for 50/50 balls even 60/40 balls...he and raul should both get benched or better still ousted from the club...he can go to maybe west ham/reggina/recreativo huelva where he belong....
as for england...he is a disgraced...when replaced by that younger winger in the world cup, we all can see the difference...england game got much better.. that's why he is not in the england team now...only stupid coach will pick him for their national team...as for the club...it's a bit more difficult..he is still in there probably because his shirts are still selling...money is important to a club...but talking about footballwise...he deserve non in a club as big as real madrid...
..common rev...be concious and truthful when assessing a player....

[Rev]

Why does Figo suddenly appeared in the debate? If you talk about Figo, I'll give you a Makelele, since he shouldn't be sold in the first place. Back to Real of today, I do think Capello made the right decision in benching Beckham for Reyes for the current formation, plus I didn't say anything about Beckham to start for Real's game did I? I also did not mention anything about Mcclaren dropping him for England is a wrong decision either, nor do I agree is a right decision. What I said was he did a lot for England to get to where they were in WC06 and for some reason people love to bash him because of his commerical appeals and good looks. If he was such a bad player, why did Alex Ferguson even bothered to start him back in United? Did you forget Beckham and United won quite a lot of silverwares together? Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying United won all those silverwares few years back are all based on Beck's abilities, but he sure played his role in order for them to be successful for some reason.


Why do you lay your blames on Beckham for Real's trophy drought? Real Madrid has been without a trophy for the past few years and there are a lot of reasons to it. There is our ex-president Perez for interrupting into sporting matters. Maybe no one to fill Makelele's shoe after he left? What about the defence line? I guess numerous coaches in 3 years also played a major role in the trophy drought. As to Beckham being consistant or not, if you watch most of Real's game last season, I don't think I have to explain myself any longer.


With him and England, you can't say they lost the world cup entirely based on him, in fact, I don't think he is the person to be pointing fingers at anyways. Think of all the games they played, Becks has been involved with either a set up to a goal, an assist to a goal, or scoring himself. If you say he isn't consistant with England, I can tell you there are players that did worse than him, does Lampard ring a bell, I'll give you another one, Rooney.


Edit for grammar.

[DriveShot]

Younger winger? His name is Aaron Lennon son. I believe Rev has said enough taking you to school.

[Zico]

I thought this thread is about Raul & Spain NT?!?! :confused:

[DMprorR]

I was going to add something, but Rev has done it for me. People should be very careful on how they critique players. one can be misled by the media or something, but for me (who used to hate Becks more than any other player) Becks is not somebody that should be on the bench in Real. Especially with Salgado and Cincinho out. This guy helped us with balance last season and even though he can't do what Figo did or what Zizou did, in his own rights, he helped our underperforming sqaud last year (who only had R9 as our only true striker). Raul right now is an excuse as a striker to me and has just been buying time in the spaniish selection. Time has caught up to him. Capello better get his head straight. He is one damn stubborn coach. That i can you. I want Reyes or Robinho to take Rauls spot and Becks in the team, and you will see more crosses to Ruud. haven't Capello figured out that Ruud plays better with crosses to him? I means come on somethings should be clear on some players qualities on where the shine the most. Sorry for that, if I start now I won't just stop.

For me I have had enough of raul. how many players get 3 years to prove themselves? Just how many? Well I guess you guys know the answer to that. Raul you were an Icon for Real,, but life goes on. We need to go on and build on the future. The spanish selection can move on with out him and also Real should move on with out him (for Real, no sentiments here, sentiments hasl eft us with no trophies for 3 years ... I can't take it any more).

[Silas]

I'd rather both Raul and Ronaldo take a rest from their country and focus on their club. :D
Now since Van Basten has given Ruud an oppurtunity to concentrate on his club, and so has Mclaren done to Beckham....this might be a good move for Madrid :D :D.

[DriveShot]

I still dont understand Van Basten not using RvN. RvN must have a very poor attitude towards him or something because he's playing well, much better than Kuyt.

[Silas]

RVN declined to play for Van Basten the jerk. And rightfully so.

[tashi]

correct me if i'm wrong but didn't raul offer to leave the club a while back?

maybe he just wants to play football, even if he is now a lousy player i think he gives his heart and soul each match.

[DriveShot]

RVN declined to play for Van Basten the jerk. And rightfully so.

Wasn't that after the WC though?

I would hardly call Raul a lousy player now. He's just finding form again after a lot of injuries. I still have faith in my dynamic duo of Raul and Ronaldo.

[taibtariq]

Younger winger? His name is Aaron Lennon son. I believe Rev has said enough taking you to school.
School?..what school?..Rev is just not a footballer ...that's why he talked like that..and you too..
the truth is that...15 years from now..nobody will remember beckham as a good footballer ..like george best...eric cantona......people will just remember him as a mediocre footballer who iis just overhyped...running like chicken all the time...without reason....that's how people..i mean people who really now about footbal will assess him...
go to school mate..or is it too late?..cheers...

[taibtariq]

I was going to add something, but Rev has done it for me. People should be very careful on how they critique players. one can be misled by the media or something, but for me (who used to hate Becks more than any other player) Becks is not somebody that should be on the bench in Real. Especially with Salgado and Cincinho out. This guy helped us with balance last season and even though he can't do what Figo did or what Zizou did, in his own rights, he helped our underperforming sqaud last year (who only had R9 as our only true striker). Raul right now is an excuse as a striker to me and has just been buying time in the spaniish selection. Time has caught up to him. Capello better get his head straight. He is one damn stubborn coach. That i can you. I want Reyes or Robinho to take Rauls spot and Becks in the team, and you will see more crosses to Ruud. haven't Capello figured out that Ruud plays better with crosses to him? I means come on somethings should be clear on some players qualities on where the shine the most. Sorry for that, if I start now I won't just stop.

For me I have had enough of raul. how many players get 3 years to prove themselves? Just how many? Well I guess you guys know the answer to that. Raul you were an Icon for Real,, but life goes on. We need to go on and build on the future. The spanish selection can move on with out him and also Real should move on with out him (for Real, no sentiments here, sentiments hasl eft us with no trophies for 3 years ... I can't take it any more).

That's what I'm talking about..any mediocre footballer can do what he did for real last season...he can just cross..even that is mediocre compare to figo, cris ronaldo.etc....that's why he is in the bench right now...i pick robinho over raul...the others can stay in the first eleven for now..until ronaldo can prove himself again...and if reyes or robinho or guti is injured or sthing..replace them with cassano...beckham can warm the bench.....

[Rev]

So according to you, those who aren't technically as gifted as Zizou and Figo, and those who will be long forgotten after 15 years from now aren't good footballer? Forgotten in who's perspective, you? Wow, what kind of theory is that?

[indomitable_lion]

Raul should retire and get it over with. I'm tired of him "needing to return to form". I can't tell the difference when he's on the pitch and when he isn't.

The man is a great goal scorer but he should go captain Athletic Bilbao or something. I'm sure they'll relax their Basque policy for the great Raul ;) That and the threat of relegation.

[DriveShot]

Obviously, he hasnt seen many Real matches with Beckham playing and gets his info from the media.

[taibtariq]

Obviously, he hasnt seen many Real matches with Beckham playing and gets his info from the media.
I dont know what to say to the above statement...:confused:
DriveShot..as an England fan, do you think that Beckham is still the best in that position for England?..haven't you ever thought of, how hard it is for Macca to drop 'the no 1 right winger aka ex-captain' (when he still wants to play) if he is still playing consistantly good?..
same goes to Raul...it takes heavy defeat in the hands of northern ireland for aragones to finally drop him from the team...it is hard for those two coaches!!, unless they're convinced and know that the public also on their sides, that their 'star' players are in bad shapes...

[DriveShot]

I never said Beckham should be in the starting 11 for England but I think he still has a lot to contribute to the team coming off the bench. The media controls the masses. If they report that England's problems are his, many people will believe it. It wasn't hard to drop him from the squad because people were so angry about England's WC performance they have to scapegoat someone. If poor WC performance means you should be dropped from the squad, we would be seeing a much different England come Saturday.

I never even said Raul should still be in the starting 11 for Spain. I was just surprised he was dropped because of his status. He hasn't been doing well for Spain and perhaps dropping him from the squad was what he needed to pick him up since his last 2 matches were great. Aragones already said he would be finding his place back into the squad soon if he continues his recent form.

Most people dislike Beckham because of his fame not because of his football skills. Watch some matches from last season. You can see Beckham hussle back and play as the last defender many times. Then come forward to start a counter-attack. His set plays were key to many goals.

As for his crossing ability mediocre to C. Ronaldo? That has to be a joke. Either you werent thinking about what you were typing or haven't seen either play very much. Are you comparing Figo of old to Beckham now? How is that a fair comparison?

[Silas]

That's what I'm talking about..any mediocre footballer can do what he did for real last season...he can just cross..even that is mediocre compare to figo, cris ronaldo.etc....that's why he is in the bench right now...i pick robinho over raul...the others can stay in the first eleven for now..until ronaldo can prove himself again...and if reyes or robinho or guti is injured or sthing..replace them with cassano...beckham can warm the bench.....
:D :D I should stop watching Scrubs and read his posts instead.

[taibtariq]

I never said Beckham should be in the starting 11 for England but I think he still has a lot to contribute to the team coming off the bench. The media controls the masses. If they report that England's problems are his, many people will believe it. It wasn't hard to drop him from the squad because people were so angry about England's WC performance they have to scapegoat someone. If poor WC performance means you should be dropped from the squad, we would be seeing a much different England come Saturday.

I never even said Raul should still be in the starting 11 for Spain. I was just surprised he was dropped because of his status. He hasn't been doing well for Spain and perhaps dropping him from the squad was what he needed to pick him up since his last 2 matches were great. Aragones already said he would be finding his place back into the squad soon if he continues his recent form.

Most people dislike Beckham because of his fame not because of his football skills. Watch some matches from last season. You can see Beckham hussle back and play as the last defender many times. Then come forward to start a counter-attack. His set plays were key to many goals.

As for his crossing ability mediocre to C. Ronaldo? That has to be a joke. Either you werent thinking about what you were typing or haven't seen either play very much. Are you comparing Figo of old to Beckham now? How is that a fair comparison?

I dont know about the media blaming beckham etc..since i dont live in the UK...all I know is that...the media always praised him undeservedly...I watched every real madrid game last season, and season before that, and season before that...and he was not good...not better than figo if figo is still there...not better than aaron boy if aaron boy is available for selection for real madrid I might guess...like i said only delivered some crosses but not anything else..his defending is a joke...did brazil 2002 first goal in the quarter finals rings bell?..that is the summary of his bravery...if you're a coach now..not influenced by anything(money etc)...who will you put on the right winger position of your team?..cris ronaldo or beckham....who will be your captain/midfielder...figo or beckham?..
now..the current real madrid...is he better than cassano?..is he better than robinho?...
as for status, that's why brasil lost the world cup...status means absolutely nothing..

[Silas]

He's miles ahead of Cassette, but not Robinho.

[taibtariq]

:D :D I should stop watching Scrubs and read his posts instead.
is that all you can say?..:rolleyes:
give some substances to the discussion...
laughing at other's opinion does not make you any wiser...wise guy...:cool:

[Silas]

The fact that you compared David Beckham's crosses to Cristiano Ronaldo's....no no....you said Cristiano's were better, exposes your exposure to football.

'nuff said.

[taibtariq]

The fact that you compared David Beckham's crosses to Cristiano Ronaldo's....no no....you said Cristiano's were better, exposes your exposure to football.

'nuff said.
nuff said?..
that's my opinion..yours might be different..does that mean that you're more exposed to football or i'm more exposed to football?..no!!..not at all...same goes to your statement that beckham is miles ahead of cassette..that deserve some good laugh..but i didn't ..because it's your opinion...
will you pick beckham over cris ronaldo if you are a coach?..

[DriveShot]

Why even pose the C. Ronaldo and Beckham comparison. They are no way even close to the same type of player?

[Silas]

Why even pose the C. Ronaldo and Beckham comparison. They are no way even close to the same type of player?
They bgoth are right wingers. What more do you need?

[pydgey]

geez... they r both good footballers

i personally like ronaldo more coz he's young, talented & has a great future ahead!

but it appears to me that becks' is not as stable - not in the england national team's department anyways... [i do feel for him :( ].